and basically told everyone like you
have to 10x your productivity with these
AI tools we're giving you or [music] you
have to leave that box and it replaced
250 full-time support people. It
replaced over 100 developers. At the
peak um with the peak we're about 500
people um we are under 100 now and still
>> still optimizing. So one [music] big SAS
that that answers everybody's questions
is going to be dead.
>> Do you think AI now can replace
copyriters?
>> It beats me now. All right, Russell, you
just finished the last with quotation
marks FHL. [laughter]
>> Come on now. It is.
>> And this one uh was all about AI. Yeah.
And so I want to get your take on what's
going on with AI and how you guys are
using and all that stuff. But before we
do, I mean, is it really actually the
last one? Because, you know, you said
that last year, too.
>> I was there last year cuz I thought it
was the last one. I was like, I got to
go to this one.
>> It was more than a year ago. It was 18
months ago. So, [laughter] we took a
whole year off. It's funny because like
um yeah, I hope it's the last one. Um
[laughter]
it's I forget like we got back into it
like oh yeah this is why we stopped
doing I forget like what goes into
producing and running an event and it's
way less profitable than if you do a
virtual event on a very specific topic
where you're curated or like you can
create the perfect event in a fiveday
virtual where you have multi-speakers.
It's it's so much harder to orchestrate
it for you know and so I don't know um
we didn't sell another one. We have
another plan for one. Uh it's weird
because I think we just did this one
because you think about FHL10 18 months
ago. Nobody, not a single speaker talked
about AI. Like AI wasn't a thing 18
months ago, you know what I mean? And
now it's everything. And so that's why
we decided to do we're like I feel like
we left everybody like unprepared. And
so that's kind of why we did it.
>> Yeah. But
>> so you guys just ran that then you just
had an event with them on uh the side
hustle summit
>> two weeks ago. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Like you just ran two of the
biggest events. Yeah. [laughter]
>> And then that one you said you had like
two million people on or something
crazy.
>> Yeah, we had just shy of two million
people registered for the for the actual
live like day one at the peak we had
203,000 active people and then over the
the 90 minutes like 1.2 million
concurrent people that watch which is
crazy for a live stream. It was amazing.
>> Wow.
>> Dang. That's nuts. So how how did the
events go for you? I mean like that's
the biggest virtual event you've ever
done. Um I I know you've had bigger
FHLs, but this being the last one, like
how did they turn out?
>> Yeah, both did great. I mean, it was it
was for me, I mean, I was nervous going
to both of them because they're both
different thing, you know, like with
with the event with him on I mean two
million people is great, but it's also
like he targets a way different demo
than I do. You know what I mean? Like
it's very much more towards the
beginners, younger people. And so it's
like it's different than I'm typically
I'm typically targeting business owners,
entrepreneurs. this is like pre that,
you know what I mean? [clears throat]
>> Like the just the meme the messaging a
side hustle summit was like made for
people that are more beginner. So that's
always a little nervous, makes me a
little nervous.
>> And then FHL AI,
>> like the offer we made for people was
not like a traditional thing we sell
FHL. Normally we sell like a $25,000
coaching. This was $150,000
>> dang
>> thing. I was like, I've never pitched
that in front of a room before, you
know. I was like, I hope
>> cuz if people don't buy it, we spend a
lot of money and effort for, [laughter]
you know, like
>> how much did it cost to put it on? Uh
this was our the nice we did Fountain
Blue. So they have the stage and the LED
wall all pre-built in. And so a lot of
like usually we spend like $3 million
just on setup which is all built into
the Fountain Blue. So that was kind of
nice. So we [clears throat] uh we broke
even on between ticket sales and like
the running the venue, we broke even on
the event. So worst case we broke even
but you know it was $150,000 offer. And
part of me is like if we only sold like
three or four like I didn't want to have
to fulfill on that either. So, it's kind
of this thing where it's just like we
need at least 20 to make this worth our
while. And we end up selling uh I think
with 31 right now there's five or six
people that are kind of
>> um
>> like four and a half million bucks.
>> Yeah,
>> that's great.
>> Which is great. Yeah.
>> Is that your average FH FHL revenue or
>> um
>> below?
>> Kind of. So, the very the very first
time we we uh did a coaching offers when
we launched the two column X coaching
program and that was our biggest we did
12 million on that one.
>> Wow. Wow. And so that was the biggest
one ever. But then the next year we we
launched 2CX, but we still had like uh I
don't know, we had like 850 people. So
we had like uh I don't know 600 people
that are already in it. So when we sold
the next time it's like oh we throw
three more 300 more people in. So it's
like oh
>> the coaching division still was doing 12
million a year or whatever. But we only
added in
>> you know 300 or 400 new people at FHL.
So it's like
>> that one year was amazing and all the
rest whatever the math is on that you
know probably probably five four or five
million.
>> Yeah. So it's kind of been going down a
little bit.
>> Yeah. Yeah, for sure.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Not so much go down, just the
first one's big and then after that we
just kind of just consistently would be
there. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Okay. What which one was 2018?
That was the first one I ever went to.
>> Is that the one uh
>> was in Florida?
>> That was my favorite FHL of all. That
was the first one you went to.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. That was the 30 Days After Grants
event, right?
>> Yeah.
>> Exactly. That's how I got a ticket.
>> Yeah, that was my favorite one we ever
did. Um that was the one that had the
most emotion for me. But what was the
question? Sorry. [laughter]
>> What which FHL was that? That was um 1 2
3 fourth one. Yeah, that was the first
one we brought in uh Barry and Blue like
stage production help us produce. That
was the first one. So that was
>> you know we've done other three prior to
that that had okay sales and then we we
ran it through their model and that's
when you know $12 million fell out the
back end.
>> Oh, so that was the first big big year.
>> Yeah. Got it.
>> Yeah. Okay.
>> What about like what's the most you've
ever made on a webinar or an event?
>> The one with them on two weeks ago so I
can't talk share actual numbers with
that but
>> All right. What was number two? Uh
number two, h there was my own where I
was involved with because I was involved
in the very first uh Dean Tony launch. I
was a partner in the business at that
point and that one I think if I remember
right like 20 I think it was like 26
million
>> 26 million.
>> That was probably the biggest one up to
that point. Um
>> which gives you a benchmark for that
one. Great. Um uh and then
>> what event was that?
>> Uh that was the very first
mastermind.com launch.
>> Okay, got it. Um, and then
Yeah.
>> So, you've done multiple events where
you did over $20 million.
>> Yeah.
>> Wow.
>> Yeah. It's
>> that's a lot.
>> It's interesting because like so much of
it is um choreography, you know what I
mean? I think a lot of people just do
events and they're like, "It's an event,
they show up and it's like the event
choreography is the art form that makes
it all, you know, makes it makes it
work." I think a lot of people don't
think through enough of that. Um, it was
interesting watching Iman's team. They
they do a similar event every 90 days
and it's not like they're not changing
it. They're just tweaking it and
tweaking it. So like I had I had the
this one the blessing coming in off like
the fifth one they've done. So like so
much of it was so fine tuned. I'm
watching as they're doing stuff. I'm
like god there's so many like
>> just cool things that I never thought
about that they're doing that um I will
now replicate for everything we're doing
going forward.
>> Yeah. what what do you think is some of
the things that you picked up because
you know we were at your office a few
months ago and Aman was there and so you
know I got to meet his team and they're
kind of showing what their first bunch
of challenges did and tweaks they made
along the way and their team is like
very uh international too so the way
that they just think and act is very
different than Americans too. Yeah. And
so I picked up a few things like it just
seemed like they were very global in how
they were going to approach their
challenge versus like US guys are very
much just focused on the US. Yep.
>> So I guess if you're going to get 2
million registrations, it's a lot easier
to do that globally.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Uh so much volume came
international which was new newer for me
too, right? Right. And it was
interesting because it's like the um the
conversion rates were way less
internationally, but the costs were so
low that the rorowaz was higher than
anywhere else. So it's kind of like a
weird you get way more volume but less
sales but still
>> you know it still works when
>> right
>> when it's all done
>> right.
>> It's interesting.
>> So you talked about AI at this FHL. So
and and you sold $150,000 AI pack. Like
what did they even get and what did you
talk about? [laughter]
Can I sell you one? You want one? I'd be
in the market. Brian Brian's a boomer.
He He literally hates AI.
>> I don't use AI. That's the I check like
the weather with AI, but that's it.
[laughter]
>> That's it.
>> The one thing you don't need AI for.
He's like, "Send me a weather reminder
what I should wear today." [laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> Can I golf?
>> It's so interesting. Um well the way
that uh obviously the whole event is
choreographed to lead towards that but
my presentation where we sold the offer.
>> I was trying to explain um have you ever
had Myron Golden on this? So Myron has a
framework he teaches he says from the
he's like he learned from the Bible.
>> I golfed with them right before your
event.
>> Oh okay.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. So he has a framework called the
four levels of value
>> and have you ever seen that or talked
through it?
>> I'm sure I have. I've heard a lot of
frame so I can't remember.
>> Oh it's the best one. It's so good.
[laughter] He says it's biblical. So I
don't know where in the Bible but he's
like cuz I was like this is the smartest
thing ever. He's like, "Well, I got it
from the Bible, so that's why." But
basically, the the gist of it is like
there's four levels of value. So, the
bottom level of value is people that
work with their hands, right? They're
using their muscles to make money. And
he's like, uh, those people work the
hardest, but he's like, but you get
capped out, like you can only work so
hard. And so, you like, he's like, way
you make more money is not by working
hard, it's by shifting your level of
value. So, like muscle, you get capped
out at, you know, 60 $70,000 a year is
the most you can make with your with
your muscle. Next level of value then is
management where you're managing a whole
bunch of muscles. And because you're
like now you're managing eight people
doing stuff, more production happens, so
you can make more money, right? Um, and
so your managers can make 100 $150,000 a
year, but they also cap out. Um, it's
like, so if you want to make more money,
you can't manage more people because you
can't manage 40 50 people, right? It's
like the only way to make more money is
to change your level of value. So the
next level is communication. Learning
how to use your mouth for money. So
sales, speaking, whatever. That's the
next level. And the communication,
there's no gap or there's no ceiling.
You can make as much you want. And then
the fourth level is um is imagination
using your mind or your money to make
more money. So those are the four levels
that people go through. And what I
talked about at funnel hacking live is
like most of the successful
entrepreneurs that are in our world,
they've done that. They they're no
longer working. You know, they started
managing teams, but now they got away
from managing teams. Now they have teams
that are running themselves and they're
communicating and having the visions and
that's how they're making their money.
But I said then this tool came out
called AI and they're like, "This is
amazing." They start jumping in and
they're like, "I'm so much more
productive. I can get three times more
stuff done in the past." But they what
happened is they actually went back down
to like the bottom level value. It's
like yeah, you're three times more more
valuable doing the worst possible thing
you could possibly doing in their
company.
>> And so that was like the the premise and
I was like
>> the way that we're using AI is different
than how most people here. Most people
are just like I'm on Chad GPT or I'm on
Claude and I'm doing this stuff and it's
like like how do you shift the levels of
value? So we went back the other way.
Okay. So level one you know working with
your muscles you two to 3x your
productivity like the next step you have
to go up back to the management. So now
it's like how do you how do you shift
yourself from working with AI to setting
yourself up and and having 10 AI agents
running underneath you now now you're
managing 10 AI agents 10 extra
productivity and then it was like in the
next step how do you go up the next
level which is like getting in all of
the um the skilled um AI agents to be
able to do this the skill sets and then
the top level is where you get to
imagine again and so the way we do in
our company um my business partner Todd
he built a big old AI box using openclaw
and everything and it basically runs is
our entire company right now, right? We
took
>> that box and it replaced 250 full-time
support people. It replaced over 100
developers. It replaced and so the level
we're trying to get to is what we was
what we're doing in ClickFunnels now
where there's one box and all of us just
talk to it and it does the entire it
runs the entire company for us.
>> And so the $150,000 offer was basically
we'll set up the box for you, we'll set
up the sub agents, we'll set up the
other thing and basically you just talk
to this and it runs your entire brand
for you, entire business. So, how many
agents or or now I'm calling them
agents, but how many employees did you
have at ClickFunnels first and now how
many do you have today?
>> At the peak,
>> um at the peak we're about 500 people.
>> Um we are under 100 now and still still
optimizing. So,
>> okay. And how many would you need if you
didn't have this box?
>> Uh 400 probably 350 400.
>> So, it's definitely replaced probably
200 plus jobs. um and the ability to
continue and it and it the thing I try
to share people too is there's two sides
of this. It's like yes they can replace
an employee or if you get a good
employee it'll 10 20 30x their
productivity. So it's like with all of
our staffs what we did we did in January
with the ClickFunnel side we flew
everybody out to Canton Georgia where
Todd's at and basically told everyone
like you have to 10x your productivity
uh with these AI tools we're giving you
or you have to leave. That became the
standard and some people adopted it and
10x and some didn't. and we lost a bunch
of people and these people became
insanely more efficient. And so we did
the same thing with the coaching side of
our business about a month ago, flew
everyone out and same thing. It's like
like right now you guys are all working
with your hands. I was like you can no
longer work with your hands. You have to
move up a level where you're managing
AI. I'm like if any of you guys are
doing your jobs anymore like you don't
have a you don't have a role here. Like
you should not be writing copy. You
should not be posting social media. Like
none of the jobs like you shouldn't be
like you got to be managing AI to be
doing those jobs. And if you can do that
and you can manage 10 AI at a time, you
just 10x your productivity and then you
know what I mean? So for us, it's not
just like firing everybody. It's the
people who can't figure out how to 10x
your productivity, they they leave and
then the people who who can now they're
doing 10 times more every single day.
You know what I mean? So that's the
that's kind of how we were how we
pitched the offer, too. It's like not
just like we're going to fire your whole
team. It's like either your team's going
to fall away because they can't keep up
or they're going to 10x and they become
way more valuable to you and to them.
But are you making more money with AI or
are you just spending less on employees?
>> Um definitely making more money with AI.
Yeah.
>> How much more?
>> Yeah.
>> Uh
I don't know how to it's hard to
quantify that cuz we did a lot like how
much is AI versus not AI, you know,
stuff like that. But I mean um
>> that's where I have a hard time
believing in AI because I hear all these
things but then I'm like okay but like
>> maybe more tasks can get done but are
people making more money? And I saw Alex
Hermosi just made a video about that too
where he's like a lot of people are
using AI to do more things, but they're
not actually making more money with the
things that are getting done.
>> Hey, real quick. I'm looking for one
company to partner with this month and
run their entire marketing and sales
department. That means we're going to
run their ads, build their funnels,
manage their CRM, hire and train their
sales team, and manage them and just
handle all of the front-end revenue for
this business. All you would have to do
is just manage fulfillment and serve
your clients well. And for doing this,
we're not going to do any kind of
equity. It is just going to be a profit
share agreement. So, if any of that
sounds interesting to you, go to
panapartners.com
right now. You can apply today. We're
only taking on one company. And so, if
you think your company's a fit, make
sure you apply today. You've got to be
doing at least $50,000 a month in
revenue in order for us to even look at
it. So go to panatopartners.com today.
>> So how do you how do you like navigate
like are we just doing more crap but
like
>> our revenue is not growing.
>> Yeah. I think it's just where how
like for me it's like the things the
things I'm specifically using AI for is
like writing video sales letters you
know. Um,
>> so like copy,
>> like copy, but then also the design, the
animation, like all the stuff, right?
And then the ad creatives that lead into
that and like and so it's all things
that are focused on sales channels
because that's what my focus is.
>> Um, on Todd's side, my business partner,
like he's
>> he's using all the AI for development.
Like we launched a new software company
called Overskill and Overskill's already
insanely profitable. It's growing really
rapidly and it's all because him and two
other dudes are talking to our big
computer and they built this huge
software platform that's,
>> you know what I mean? So, so those are
the things where it's like very very
tied to revenue. Like this is a new
business that's 100% built on AI. Here's
the the ads and the video sales letters.
But you're right, there's all these
other roles that maybe it's harder to
tie revenue to. But if my lawyer can get
contracts back to me in an hour versus a
week,
>> you know, does it make more money and
it's hard to to rationalize, but
probably, you know, it speeds things up
and
>> I don't know.
>> Got it. What is that new software you
have? What is it?
>> It's called Overskill. What is it?
>> It's uh software that builds software.
And so um ever since we use I've I've
currently built out I think I'm at 37
full-blown software companies. I've
created uh in the last three months by
myself without any coders.
>> Wow.
>> And so I'm using right now as I'm
creating full software companies and
we've rolled those as as bonuses for all
the things that we're selling. And so
it's
>> dramatically increasing conversions
because
>> So you're just making products with it
essentially.
>> Yeah.
>> Where do you think software is going?
because you know a lot of software
companies are getting crushed with uh AI
now just doing things they used to do
for free.
>> Yeah. [laughter]
>> And you've been in the software business
for a long time now.
>> Yeah. I think big software is going to
be really hard. I understand
ClickFunnels now like people can build a
funnel in AI platforms and they got to
hook it to something but a lot of like
our unique what we what we did uniquely
of having an editor. You can drag and
drop things like people can do in AI. So
I think bigger companies struggle, but I
think using software for like the
reality is most people are just going to
build custom software for every use case
they need because that's easier than
like um what's the big sales CRM
everyone uses?
>> Salesforce.
>> No, HubSpot.
>> The one like all the high ticket guys
use close skills. Yeah. Yeah. cuz we had
closed for a little bit for our little
sales team we're running and it was like
there's like 90% of the features we
don't need and there's like 10% we're
using and we're like but you're paying
for all the stuff and then it doesn't do
like these things you wanted. So we just
guy on my team Sean who's running it
he's just like I'm just going to build
the version I want. So we built it add
his features and now it does 100% of
what we want to do and it's small and
it's tight and if he wants to add a
feature he just talks to it and 30
minutes later the features added. You
know what I mean?
>> Oh that's cool.
>> And so it's like
>> I think that's where software is going
is just the custom. So I think one big
SAS that that answers everybody's
questions is going to be dead. But I
think people can customize it or the
platforms allow you to create your own
or the key.
>> So did Clickfunnels like the app like
fall off?
>> No, we still I mean it's still a $50
million business. We have a lot of users
are still using it. It's just new people
are like
>> and even even our members we had we've
had to build tools or something like you
can build um you can build a funnel in
Claw Design or whatever, right? And then
you can plug it into Clickfunnels uh
through our what's it called? M no h
some name I can't remember but it
integrates it hooks up like the order
form the shopping carts and the data. So
like it's the pages but it can pull all
the data back and then you can do all
the CRM and click funnels and stuff
>> because most people just
>> like people aren't logging into editors
and making 40 page long sales funnels
anymore. You know what I mean? When you
can you can do the same thing in 15
minutes. Yeah. Yeah.
>> And so it's just like the unique thing
we had before, like when Clicks first
came out, the unique thing was the fact
you could create a page and you can move
things around.
>> Anyone can do it. You don't have to
code.
>> Yeah. Now it's like nobody wants to move
things around. They just want to have AI
do the best version. And then this is
usually better than most people's first,
you know,
>> version. Well, that's what I was
thinking too, like just watching
technology progress and where, you know,
if this is where it is today, where's it
going to be? You know,
>> and [clears throat] you know, I was just
showing you actually two of our apps
that we just use internally, right? And
so, you know, we have a dashboard that
we use for our sales and marketing and
ads and like we built it ourselves from
scratch because we, you know, I have
multiple businesses and multiple sales
teams and, you know, all this stuff and
it's like there is really no solution
that fits my problem specifically.
>> And then, you know, we made our M19 golf
app because, you know, we were on school
for like a year and, you know, using
that it's whatever. And then like it's
great for just if you want people to
post and that's about it. But for us
it's like well we have golf trips, we
have DMs, we have local groups, we have
industry groups and we have like all
these special needs
>> very specific to what you want. Yeah.
>> Yeah. And and and it creates such a
better user experience if we could
really create a specific option. And so
um with one guy I have one tech guy on
staff. I mean, we built that, you know,
I had the idea about six months ago to
start doing it, but once it came time to
like building I mean, we had it done in
about three months.
>> Yeah.
>> And I bet today you could do it in 24
hours. That's the reality. Like I had
the same thing. We spent $150,000 on
this app we had built and it got it
done. And then that's when we were doing
overskll and I was like, I wonder how
fast I could do it. So, I took
screenshots of each of the finished
pages in the app, uploaded over skill,
within 30 minutes, it rebuilt the entire
thing.
>> Yeah.
>> I was like, and now I can now I can edit
it because I couldn't before
[clears throat]
>> uh it starts at 25 bucks a month and
then for credits. Yeah.
>> Well, and see that my my cost I pay for
credits, but when all said and done, I
was probably 500 bucks to rebuild the
whole thing.
>> Wow.
>> And that's what I was getting at too
where even with other current SAS
products, and you're in the SAS world,
so it just is what it is. But it's like,
you know what, make me uh this app, but
you know, I want some changes for myself
and I want to use it this way and to
your point, upload all the different
things it needs. And it's like, here you
go
>> and then you don't have a monthly
subscription and it's custom to you. And
I'm like, dude, what's
>> and you want to add something and it's
like I don't have to talk to a
developer. I just like
>> just tell my
>> click the button. I'm like, hey, can you
add this, too? Or take a screenshot.
It's like when you were showing me your
app, I was like,
>> if I just got a screenshot of every
single page, I could rebuild it for
myself in by tonight. You know what I
mean?
>> I'm gonna get over.
>> It was amazing.
>> I'm getting overkill for sure. Yeah, you
sold me. This is my first. Let's go.
[laughter] This is the first day. So
that's like what should I eat tonight?
Overkill.
>> Yeah. [laughter] So you're in with the
25 a month.
>> At what point does Overskill, you know,
send you a VSSL to book a call to get
[laughter] 150 150k offer.
>> That is the new plan.
So yeah, like I mean honestly, do you
see Clickfunnels just continuing to
decline with like AI or how's it going
to play out?
>> No, so we um we are at FHL we introduced
the new Click Funnels, Click Funnels AI
and it's just it's it looks like claw
whatever you're like I want this funnel
and it builds the funnel, builds the
pages, builds everything. And so what
we're custom we're we're optimizing
towards that. We're um with the new
version, we're not going to be doing CRM
and all the all this stuff. Like it's
just going to be a funnel builder, but
what's cool is because it's um all done
through AI. Um it'll build the funnels,
but then it'll also um split test and
optimize for you in real time all the
time. And then you can do it based on
traffic source. Like just by you build a
funnel in the new ClickFunnels, as
traffic's coming, it'll just keep
getting better and optimizing and
tweaking and optimizing and tweaking and
just does it all because AI because it's
on AI platform without an editor, we
have the ability to do all sorts of
stuff. And so that's where we're going
with it. And it'll be it'll be simpler.
It'll be a $25 a month uh plan and you
can build your funnels in there. And
then uh you got to pay for credit. So if
you're building a lot of funnels, you'll
pay for the credits to build new stuff.
But the most part it'll [clears throat]
be um it'll be very custom just
specifically for funnels.
>> Have you done a webinar yet where you
had AI Russell do the whole pitch and
the whole presentation?
>> Um no. I've done VSSL, not the webinar.
Okay. Um, I know I could, but like
>> that'd be interesting.
>> That'd be cool. I do remember this is
way back, this probably, man, 15 years
ago. Uh, there was a guy though who
wrote a webinar pitch, but he had he was
from New York, had a really thick New
York accent and it was just hard to kind
of understand him and he didn't do very
well. So, he took the same webinar and
he just um he hired a voice actor in the
UK with a [clears throat] very nice
voice to just read the script and then
they plugged it in and it crushed and it
killed for him.
>> Wow. So I think there's a version of
that where if you can train it on your
tonality and things like that. Um
>> do you think that will happen in the
future?
>> I think it's close now. Like we we do it
with uh so we use 11 labs to um so my I
have a personal development site. I have
like 150 personal development books in
the site. So I took me reading my audio
book and we had 11 labs uh learn how I
read books and then I read all 150 books
like you can listen to Russell read the
books now in our membership site. Mhm.
>> And so it would be as simple as taking
like me pitching from stage and training
11 Labs on my on the Russell pitch voice
and then giving you a script and it
could
>> it could do it pretty well.
>> You'd be able to tell some things that
are just kind of weird but
>> um you get pretty close.
>> That's kind of how I've seen it too with
like you know people use AI for ads and
everything else. It's like I've seen
people who just aren't good at ads like
AI outperforms them because it's like
well you kind of suck ads. [laughter]
Um, but if you're like one of the best
presenters of all time, it's like AI is
going to take some catching up to beat
you.
>> Yeah, I agree.
>> It's kind of like with copywriting too.
You hear that with like great
copywriters. They're like AI can't touch
a great copywriter, but some schmuck
obviously it's way better.
>> Do you think AI now can replace
copywriters? Like great copyriters.
>> It beats me now.
>> Really?
>> Really beats you now?
>> Um, not by default. Not by just out of
the box. So
>> you've customized it to beat
>> Yeah. What I do is um I [clears throat]
I did a whole session on this during
FHL, but it's like there's like three
parts of it because if you're like,
"Hey, AI, make me a sales letter." It'll
give you something and it always sucks.
So, for me, it's like step number one is
funnel hacking. So, I'll go back through
and like what I I we did um if you go to
secretsofpropaganda.com, there's an
hourong video sales letter we did and it
was after I got back from Agora. So, the
first thing I did, I was like, "Agor is
the best video sales letters in the
world. No one beats them." And so uh I
went and found 37 Agora VSSLs and I had
AI transcribe them all, analyze them all
and from that all but two fit the ex
follow the exact same script structure.
It's like cool. I got perfect script
structure from from um from Agora. So I
was like ai this is like the structure
of how it has to be. And number two, I
was like you have to learn my voice. So
I found uh my voice of like how I speak
and and I added that to AI and then uh I
dumped in the stories I wanted to have
for the copy. And so when it had those
three things, it writes insanely good
stuff. M
>> um and so that's the key is like if you
put the effort in ahead of time uh it'll
it'll beat you in copy. But you got to
you got to know like it's finding the
right swipe files, finding the right
things and plug it all in and then then
it it'll win.
>> What about VSSLs?
>> That's what Yeah, we've done 14 VSSLs in
the last [clears throat]
like four months and it's allowed all of
them.
>> They're all AI.
>> All right.
>> You're not in them at all.
>> Uh uh sometimes I'm in them. I'll do
some where like I'm speaking to camera.
So I'll read the voice over. the AI
wrote script. I read the camera and then
we lay we overlay like uh AI animation
on top of like I'm telling a story.
It'll pull in parts of it and then come
back and forth and back to camera and
goes back and forth like that.
>> Let's talk about ads because I I think
like in some of Ryan's businesses like
ad um cost per lead or like cost per per
book call is like going up.
>> So, how can AI fix those problems?
>> Um man, it's probably on volume. That
was only one. Yes. About what I learned
from watching them on. One of the things
I that I learned the biggest was uh they
had 4,500 ad creative that we created
for that launch. Like 4,500 unique ads
and and so like it was interesting
because the way they did it is they
basically written five five different uh
five different ads and each ad had like
15 different hooks and then three or
four different CTAs. So what happened is
we'd set up the cameras like in a in a
set like this and me and M would be
there and we did we'd record
[clears throat] like hook one, hook two,
hook three, like all 15 hooks and then
the core body and the three CTAs and we
do number two 15 different hooks and do
all the way across. So we end up with
like whatever the math is on that and
then we break down the cameras. We find
it different now we shift it this
direction and we restart over and did it
again and we broke it down. We put
ourselves in a car and we drove around
the block for four hours and we did all
those again and then we did it and so
like that's what we did. So, like how AI
would help me is like figuring out what
are the five ads, what are the
>> what are the 50 different hooks, what
are the,
>> you know what I mean? And then putting
them in teleprompter, scripting them
out, and then that's how we got 4,500
ads for that launch, which is
>> if you're doing 4,500 ads, how do you
track which one is converting to more
sales?
>> I don't run ads. I don't know. But they
they can they can they can see which
ones are like what the CPM, what the
CPA, like all different things based on
every single creative plug in there. So,
I don't know how that works, but the ad
people do. M
>> it sounds to me like you've been in
marketing for a long time. Like it used
to be, man, the best marketers pretty
much win because they just their skill
set is so good compared to the normal
person, you know? And so for a long
time, great marketers could sell bad
products and like win.
>> And now it's like as the tables start to
shift where like everyone can market
pretty easily with AI, everyone could
have AI run ads, everyone can create a
good funnel now. Like
>> it's kind of like the marketer skill set
is um being enhanced if you're really
good, but also too like the floor is
raising for people who can just had no
marketing savviness at all and now they
can do it for like no money.
>> Yeah.
>> Um I guess me thinking about that, do
you think like cost per leads continue
to rise or does this just keep getting
more competitive? How do you think it
plays out?
>> Yeah, I mean that's the hardest thing is
there's so many more people playing the
game. You know what I mean? Like
>> Yeah. [clears throat] 10 years ago, the
number of people playing the game was
like, at least in my market, were so
much less. And now it's like um Yeah, I
I think it's
>> How many competitors have you built of
your own? [laughter]
>> Yeah. Way too many. We're all competing.
>> All the competitors. Yeah. Everyone
>> all We should track all that back and
see. Yeah. [laughter]
>> Yeah. Um Yeah. It's It's interesting
because I do think that because it's
like to be because you're asking if the
ad costs are going up, like what would
you do? like I'd probably create a
thousand new creative which is like most
people aren't willing to do that. So
most are going to fall out but those who
do but then it's like when is enough
then when does every you know then now
we need 10,000 everyone do a thousand
then yeah it just starts getting to the
spot where yeah I don't I don't know
where it all goes it's
>> it's a lot of noise a lot of a lot of
stuff
>> what about international did you used to
market international
>> we personally do very little other than
like the core you know like UK Australia
like like some of those um why why did
you why didn't you guys do just
>> I think because everyone said that they
they didn't and like a lot of times
we're selling um events and things or
sometimes the currency is harder where
you know click phones 97 bucks a month
and that's that's what some people make
in a year in some country you know what
I mean so it's like so it's hard to
justify those um it might have seen the
first one I've seen who have really just
crushed that so I don't know it's
interesting it makes me want to go back
and look at more of that and I think a
lot of interesting a lot of people just
don't see any ads it was this is one of
the other things I got from them that
was fascinating is for their event they
didn't use Zoom at all it's all 100% on
YouTube so you look at their funnel they
get you to register and it's like all
right the events happening on YouTube.
Go subscribe and turn on notifications.
And so, like,
>> how many subscribers did he get?
>> A ton. I just remember uh at the end of
day one, they said we added 35,000 pe
new subscribers from that session. Just
that one. I had like during the week, I
added 90,000 new subscribers on
Instagram. Just
>> I don't know what they
>> 90,000 new ones
>> in one. Yeah. Just by being hanging out
with them. Um
>> I I my guess is they probably added half
a million people to their YouTube
subscribers over the campaign because
every single person pushed to there. um
>> that actually makes sense to push people
to YouTube because then they keep going
back
>> then like turn on notifications for day
number two so everyone's turn
notifications on and then what's cool is
like you even these countries where
they're people aren't using marketing to
now they're following on YouTube and
again they're they're getting
underserved versus all of us are get you
all of our world's getting so much
people and like so now the next video
Aman throws out there you're getting all
these third world countries that don't
normally get stuff they're all watching
so they're you know you're getting a
million views before it even hits
everybody else and like Yeah.
>> And and what they every challenge
happens back on YouTube. So, it's just
like this compounding thing where each
one gets bigger and bigger because
>> Yeah.
>> more people, more [clears throat]
followers. So, that was fascinating. I
don't think I'll ever use Zoom again for
an event.
>> Wow.
>> After seeing
>> That's actually really smart.
>> What do you think? Uh
I one thing when we were at your office
that I was thinking about them, I was
like, "Dude, these dudes are young."
Like, how are these guys this smart this
young?
>> I know. It's It was crazy.
>> They're all low mid 27.
We're getting old now. I found like when
I was
>> but they were like doing things that
people been forever have not thought of
doing or do.
>> I know the YouTube thing. The only other
person I've ever seen do that is Alex
Heroszi
>> when he did his book launch on YouTube.
>> Yeah.
>> But I didn't even think about that. That
>> Well, he just did it everywhere.
>> Yeah.
>> I think he was on Zoom. He was on
>> He was on Zoom, but he was the first
person that I that I've seen do a big
webinar and it'd be on YouTube.
>> Yeah.
>> I can't remember anyone else doing that
before.
>> I hadn't at all.
>> Yeah. And I went to his I went to his
workshop and when I was there more than
50% of the people were not from the
United States.
>> Like I don't want to exaggerate and say
like 70 to 80 but I was like talking to
my neighbors and there was like people
from France, people from
>> fascinating. I went to uh like two years
ago my did event had me speak at it and
it was fascinating because he asked he's
like he's like how many of you guys in
the audience found me on YouTube in the
last 90 days? And it was like twothirds
of the audience. I was like holy cow.
Like I had no idea that that much new
blood was coming into his world just off
the YouTube.
>> Yeah.
>> Anyway, it's it was Yeah. really
interesting.
>> How's your YouTube going?
>> Never been good at YouTube. That's what
I'm [laughter] like I don't know. It
drives me I think you talked about so
like I Yeah. I haven't figured it out.
So like but now I'm like
>> if had I have the last three years every
challenge or event we did if I run it on
YouTube like doing way better because
we'd have so many more people but also
people who spent 5 days with us in that
platform in that place. You know what I
mean? and they can come back and watch
more stuff.
>> Yeah. Such a lost opportunity that I
didn't understand now. Um where now it's
again like we're gonna we're planning a
big event in January. I'm like in fact
even my fulfillment event from the Aman
thing. I'm having it on YouTube. I'm
like these people are all YouTube
people. Might as well just do it there
and and you know get them all over
there. So
>> I don't know. It's interesting.
>> Yeah. So what do you think about uh just
the future of events too because you
know if this is the last FHL I know
personally like I last year I said hey
this is my last wealthcon you know I was
doing them every quarter
>> and it really is like [laughter]
>> you were doing a lot we first came out
you're like every every quarter I was
like how in the world are you doing that
>> and I just you know last year was the
last one and uh definitely have no itch
[laughter]
no desire to do another I'm like I'm
good and it was a great run it was a
great ride. Um, but I just see how hard
they are, the return versus effort, the
risk, the,
>> you know, just everything about it. And
so it's like I'm not like super bullish
on big live seminars anymore.
>> Yeah.
>> Um, but clearly, you know, we're talking
about fiveday challenges, webinars, like
what what is your future of business
events? Yeah, I think it's it's tough
because you you can make way more in a
in a virtual and it's easier and it's
less stress and you know there's so many
like I think about FHL like we've spent
FHL 10 I think we spent 7 million to
produce that and launch that event right
where if I would have put that same
thing to a challenge just looking at the
numbers we would have made I don't know
20x you know had done that there and a
live event's tough because you because
again
>> in a fiveday challenge like I have a
very curated
thing on teaching to to set up a sale
versus at a funnel acting live is tough
because there's multi speakers and so
it's like even though I'm trying to get
speakers like follow this process this
is the through line they're still
bouncing all over the place and they're
distracting people and it's like I have
to have a presentation every like three
or four presentations like bring it back
to like the through line to set up the
sale later you know
>> that's
>> and so that's really that's a lot harder
but man there's something magic about
you get people in the room and there
that's the hard thing I keep trying to
think like how do I
like how do I create an event that
doesn't require me having to to pay for
the event. You know what I mean? Like
like how do I find
>> five or six people who we can all bring
our audiences and we have a big event
where we get the community stuff but not
have to worry about like spending $6
million in ads or making an offer that
to make you know where we can just have
a a party like a I don't know that's
>> Well, can I tell you too like I that was
the part I hated about events too. It's
like all the stress that goes into it
and then the pitch has to go perfect and
you know, you got to fill the room,
>> try and make it not lose a ton of money,
you know, filling it and then you got to
pitch and, you know, do all this stuff.
>> If pitch goes wrong, then you just lost
six months of your life, a ton of money.
>> Oh, yeah, dude. We had we threw an event
one time
>> and a guru, I'm not going to say his
name,
>> I bet I guess. Just kidding.
>> Don't tap me. [laughter]
But this guru uh he's like a real estate
guy and uh he went up and he switched
his presentation last minute
>> and we didn't know about it and he went
up and pitched his own thing
>> like right before Ryan was supposed to
do his main pitch.
>> It was crazy.
>> I like bombed our
>> the one we did at uh Eric Warriors the
international one.
>> Uhhuh. We had a speaker who was supposed
to speak right before me right for the
pitch and he's he's a great teaches
people how to speak and presentation was
amazing and he was supposed to fly here
and do it and then didn't make his plane
and so he's like I'm going to do it from
my studio does it from a studio and
literally
>> the presentation for mine he pitches a
>> like we're all watching watching all of
a sudden he like throws up a QR code
like here's my public speaking and like
pitches uh a cheaper version what I was
selling right before I did and I was
just like
>> and he's like remote like I'm like cut
the cameras like shut That's what I was
doing backstage. I was like, "Turn him
off. Turn him off."
>> But it was too late. Everybody in the
room was like
>> doing his thing. Honestly,
>> such a scumbag, honestly. But [laughter]
no, seriously, think about that. We had
a big event that we spent
>> seven figures, not seven figures, almost
seven figures to throw. And then he went
up there, switched his presentation, and
then did a full on pitch. Full not like,
oh, like here's my QR code, like QR
code, handle objection, you know,
repitch, handle objection. And I was
just, we were backstage. I was like, I
can't believe he's doing this right now.
It was so crazy. and he signed a
contract that he wasn't supposed to do
it. But Ryan's such a nice guy, he did,
you know, he was just like whatever
about it. But
>> well, and the funniest thing,
>> did he split the money with you at
least?
>> No, of course not.
>> Well, I think that also the funniest
thing about it, too, was it was unlike
yours the exact same thing. It was
actually the anti- pitch.
>> Yeah.
>> Of my thing.
>> Oh, really?
>> It was, hey, you shouldn't flip houses,
buy rentals. And I'm like about to tell
everyone to flip houses.
>> How did it affect your pitch then on
next thing?
>> I'm smiling so funny. you're tweeting
like [laughter] I can I can feel the
energy right now. Like I
>> No, I'm I'm always active. Um
>> No, this is this just
>> I don't I don't call people out. Like I
don't care. So if Brian wants to do it,
he can do it. Um
>> probably bleep it out. But
>> no, I mean I just I just still pitched
and you know for me it was like
whatever. It's fine.
>> Did it affect your pitch though? Could
you tell? Did it affect sales?
>> Oh well I basically
>> I basically went on after and I was just
like
>> pretty much f everything he just said. I
literally said that.
>> Yeah. But no, look, it gets worse. Brian
doesn't like to stir the pot. I'm a rage
baiter. We'll talk.
>> Yeah. Yeah, we'll talk. So, I'm at
dinner that [laughter] night, right? And
then I get a text from the guru who text
the whole event and said, "Hey guys, uh
the the we got so many people that were
responded. We're only bringing on five
more people. Make sure to I just I just
was talking to Ryan like we need five
people uh and then we're going to shut
it down blah blah blah blah blah during
the event." And I'm like, "Oh my god."
And like people at the dinner table are
like, "Oh, I just got a text from
>> Dang, that's worse than mine." Yeah,
that sucks. [laughter]
>> Yeah.
>> But it goes back to live events are like
super risky because if it bombs,
>> like you're out all this money, time,
effort, and then it sucks because you
want to try to enjoy the event, but then
you're like,
>> "Dang." Like,
>> we just wasted like [laughter]
>> Well, you know, you just take
accountability. You're just like, "Well,
I invited the wrong person."
>> Yeah. [laughter]
>> Like that's why I don't ever I'm just
like whatever, you know?
What's the worst thing you've ever had
happen at your event?
>> Um,
it's not worse than that. You guys,
[laughter] I don't even know. I don't
even know. Um,
>> have you ever had a like an event just
bomb?
>> Yeah. I've had offers where I pitched
the event and nobody would buy or
[laughter] very few. The one before
>> that you're like, I screwed up.
>> Yeah. The one before Barry and Blue is
one that I I did and it that was the
first one we like made I mean we made
some sales but not even enough to cover
break even and it was just like wow that
sucks. a whole year we spent
>> damn
>> for you know for Phyllis event and not
and then that's when I met Barry and
Blue and then they're like yeah that was
>> what did you do wrong like why did it
bomb
>> umh
it's a good question um
>> it's like it's a blur I don't even
[laughter] remember
>> I remember it's like so Tony was our
keynote it was the first time Tony come
and spoke and I was so excited for that
and then I was like well most people
were going to be there for Tony so I'm
going to pitch right before Tony so it
was like it was a weird pitch spot
>> and I think People were so like it was
almost like the event was done and Tony
was about to come in but I'm like hey
real quick and I did my thing and it
just and the pricing was wrong like it
was like a $2,000 thing which I was just
so like we sold a few but it was like we
would had to sell like most of the room
for it to like
>> make [clears throat] sense
>> to make enough money to even made sense.
I don't know. I think that like I ran
out of time ahead of time and like the
offer wasn't thought through all the way
and just a lot of those little things
>> really.
>> I had something like when we did the um
so the grant one where we did the 3.2
And then um
>> and then we did FHL 30 days later to the
12th. So like two in a row. I was like
I'm unstoppable. Everything I do turns
to gold. And uh they asked me to speak
at this at this event in uh in Atlanta
and Tony Robbins was going to be the
keynote. I was going to speak and
>> and I was like I had this idea. I was
like I have a new offer. It's going to
be way better. And I was like I'm going
to do a lower price so I can sell it to
the entire audience and take them out.
So like, so I dropped the price and I
made this thing and um and I remember
because because Clickfunnels we process
so much other people's money, we have
different rule rules than a normal
vendor from Stripe. Like we have to have
like lock boxes with order. There's all
these different rules we have to do
because uh for PCI compliance and
everything cuz we're processing, you
know, a couple billion dollars a year
for clients. So anyway, we have
different rule sets. So we had to come
to this event with like locked boxes and
like to hold order forms and we had a
whole team. like and we just come off
two big wins. So I'm like, "Oh, we're
going to sell like there supposed to be
like 9,000 people in this event." So
then we get there and uh there's 9,000
chairs in the room, but there's like
3,000 in the room and the whole empty
sea and Tony's out there doing his whole
thing and I'm like, "Oh, that's kind of
weird." And I get out there to speak
>> and uh and you know that feeling when
you're like you're like 30 minutes into
a presentation, you're like this is not
landing. Nobody's [laughter] going to
buy this thing. And I was like, I want
to like tell my team to flip the slides
back to my normal pitch, but I was like,
it's not going to work.
>> And so then I'm trying to like rewrite
this thing in my as I'm speaking, but my
slides are stuck because I can't change
them. And I'm like, so I'm going through
the whole thing.
>> And I do the offer at $497 to the room
of 3,000 that's mostly empty, you know.
>> And I think we sold like 30. And I was
just like and [laughter] and I come
backstage and one of the other speakers,
you guys know who he is, um
he's very opinionated dude, but he was
just like, "Man, all these lock boxes
for uh for like 30 sales, man, like
that." And I [laughter] was just like I
was just like I was so embarrassed. I
was like, "I never want to sell again."
Like I quit this whole business. It was
so [laughter] embarrassing. So that was
my most It was like the walk of shame.
And then he had to like like wow. Like
he couldn't just like shut his mouth. He
had to say something.
Um, uh,
>> is it Grant?
>> No, no, no. It's, uh,
>> Gary,
>> he's in your guys's world. He's a, uh,
>> he's in your guys' world. Say real
world.
>> Hold on. I, [laughter]
>> you got to cut this, though, cuz he
he'll he'll message me. I know him.
He'll be like, um,
>> you guys know I love the game of golf,
and that is why I started M19. It is a
golf mastermind for entrepreneurs who
are doing over seven figures in their
business and who want to go on bucket
list golf trips together. We already
have hundreds of members all across the
country. And we've been to some of the
best courses in the world. Places like
Pebble Beach, Pinehurst, Bandon Dunes,
and many others. The course is the best
place to do deals, make great
relationships, and have fun. So go to
mastermind 19.com today.
>> I don't even know who that is.
>> Oh, you don't? Okay, never mind.
>> Everyone's laughing out there.
[laughter]
>> All right, that's all. Yeah.
>> Yeah. I don't even know who that is.
>> Yeah, he's he's great. He's a great
pitchman. His offer is really It's just
weird. It's just like get famous like me
and
>> he's very successful. very um very
ligious and yeah he was just like I walk
back and he just like just cut me to my
knees right then I'm like oh anyway so
it hurt
>> when you're pitching virtually can you
tell when you're bombing
>> yeah I like having comments I don't look
at the comments but you can see the flow
of them
>> and if they're engaged this stuff's
happening
>> if you're like put a one in the chat and
then there's like
>> okay [laughter]
>> there's no one
>> oh this is problem we had with with the
launch is like again there's whatever
over 200,000 people live
>> all these languages all It was crazy cuz
like he turns off the chat during the
pitch so that he's like, "Hey, we're
going to turn the chat off to so it's
not distracting cuz there's so many
people cruising through there
>> and they're like, "Screw this."
>> And so like, yeah. So day two he did the
pitch and then I'm coming right
afterwards. So I come back in and I was
like, "Turn the chats on guys. I want to
see what's happening." And then like
it's like and like everyone's like been
built up anger who didn't want to get
pitched out. She's like dropping them.
>> Oh no. [laughter]
>> And uh and everyone's dropping like L's
which I you know.
>> Oh that's funny.
>> And so I didn't know. The next day,
Myron gets out there and um and so he's
doing like the rep pitch and Myron
[clears throat] comes out. He's like,
"All right, first thing if you guys want
to learn how to leverage your business,
type L's in the chat." And he's like,
"Who hears love this?" Then type L's in
the chat. He kept using like L's like
[laughter]
all it's all the L's. People are like
angry like it was so funny. So I was
trying to use that too, but I got
roasted [laughter] right after my mom's
pitch with my and my wife was in the
hotel room watching it and she's
freaking out cuz she's seen the chats
like everyone wants to kill Russell.
Like what's anyway [laughter] it was so
chats are on YouTube. That's like the
one downside. Maybe soon you can like
kick people out. YouTube, you're just
like taking it.
>> You're just taking it. [laughter]
>> It's bad.
>> That's I do remember watching you on
another pitch that was funny was which
[laughter] was at Katon's event.
>> Wait, which one?
>> Uh
>> oh.
Yeah, that one didn't go too well. That
was Well, cuz like the demo [laughter]
they didn't load the demo video. The de
Like
>> that was bad.
>> Why was it bad? [laughter]
>> That was
>> Well, I just remember I was sitting
there. I was like, "Oh, I I haven't
watched Russell Pitch in like a long
time. I want to watch this." And I was
like watching it and like I you know,
I'm in the game. I'm like, "Yeah, this
is not
>> I was like, "This is not going
[laughter] well."
>> Dude, it was bad. Well, they they
announced me, I come out and I come out
there and there's no slides. I'm like,
"Hey everybody, how's it going?" Like,
>> well, also the audience is a bunch of
like doortodoor like
>> hustle kind of guy. Like these guys are
not internet marketers.
>> Andy Elliott's team.
>> And there's
>> Yeah. And I was like, I don't think this
[laughter] is the right product market
fit right now. And then the other the
other problem was like I was supposed to
speak I was supposed to speak earlier in
the day um and I got in a in a fight
backstage with another speaker.
>> Yeah, I heard about this too. Which
>> speaker? Why?
>> So So I got bumped. Can we bleep it out?
>> So I got bummed. So like [laughter] so
he went he went till like . I was
supposed to close till 1. So I got
bummed. So I started at 1. So So he gets
done and he's a great speaker. One of
the greatest speakers of all time. He'll
tell you
>> buddy of mine. Let's leave it at that.
>> So and so then everyone goes they he
gets done. They're all crying and then
they go run to eat and so like I'm
coming. Is it Ed? [laughter]
>> Yeah. I haven't talked to Ed since then.
>> Oh no. You I didn't know that.
>> I was just like Ed I want to explain.
I'm like there's two type of speakers,
Ed. There's people like you who they pay
to come and motivate the crowd. There's
people like me who pay their own way and
I have to eat what I kill. So, it's like
[laughter]
you totally like I fought hard for two
months to have this spot because this is
how I get paid and you bumped me.
Anyway, it it was um
>> So, wait, what did he do? Is it just
because he sucked the energy out of the
room cuz they're all crying and like
motivated or
>> also they had to go eat and it was the
wrong time to pitch and
>> Oh.
>> Uh yeah.
>> Oh, so it's just a time slot. It's not
that
>> I find hard time like it's a one day
event.
>> The problem was Ed wanted to switch to
his time.
>> Oh, okay. cuz he had the perfect time to
pitch and then he got a
>> and then it's hard to go up and pitch
when everyone's like crying and like
calling their mom.
>> Well, also it's like it's like now he
gets done. They're all starving so
they're clearing out. I get up there my
slides don't work and then finally do my
thing and I get to the demo and I click
demo video and there's no video and I'm
like so I try for like two or three
minutes. I'm like well I guess I'll skip
the demo and I went [laughter] on and I
I come backstage and I was like where's
the demo video? Like oh it was too big
to download. I'm like oh my god
>> why didn't you tell me that before I got
on stage like [laughter] I look like an
idiot. It's like it's like a seven
minute part of my pitch. Like it's the
most important. I was that that was the
>> How much did you sell?
>> Um almost nothing. [laughter] I don't
remember.
>> I I remember watching I was like this is
not going
for everyone watching.
>> I know. And then I I remember
>> I hope you enjoyed this uh this podcast
of all wrestles failures [laughter]
publicly public shaming and humiliation.
>> So yeah, I don't remember if it was a QR
code or like the form, but what there
was just no action.
It was bad. I remember. So, other side
story. So, so that venue is called the
East Center in Salt Lake. And my So, my
junior year in high school, I won the
state title. My senior year, they
shifted it to the East Center. So, I've
been in that building once in my life.
And uh I ended up losing to a kid that I
destroyed threw me and caught me. I
ended up losing my state title my senior
year in that room. So, I haven't been
back since then. So, I was like, "That
building I hate. It's jinx. I've been
there 20 years." I was like, "This is
going to be a new thing. Retribution."
So I went back and I was like that
building is jinxed. I will never go in
the e center again. Next time I go I
guarantee it'll be Yeah. So
>> it's encouraging for everyone listening
cuz you know they hear the best. You
know they have
>> I brag about the two times I did it
right. Everyone the rest [laughter] have
been horrible.
>> You start off with you made $20 million
on a couple webinars. It's not bad to
you know. [laughter]
>> Dude, that's so funny. Yeah. I had I
have a friend, she's a she's a pastor
and she said one time
>> while she was building her church, her
church is huge now, but like while she
was building up, she said one time her
audience was one person and during her
sermon they got up and walked out.
[laughter]
>> Please don't leave. She said she turned
to the camera and just did her YouTube
live, but there was no one on there. But
yeah, [laughter]
>> I had one time we we were launching
Click Funnels. I was doing like two or
three webinars a day just and we had one
line in Australia. So it was like
or 5 in the morning for me but I was
like you know what we're going to serve
the Australian people and [laughter] I'm
so tired all there and we turned it on
and um there's three people and I was
like [laughter] are you kidding me? And
I was like I don't want to do this but
also like the then my my buddy who's a
vet he's like yes hey everyone so happy
Russell here. I was just like, "You
brought three people." Like, [laughter]
"It's a.m." I was just like,
>> "So, yeah, I did the whole thing,
though. I didn't [laughter]
That's nice."
>> It was
>> You got your You could have just done
Q&A.
>> At that point, you're like, "Let's do
Q&A." Who wants to
[laughter] do it?
>> I just need to have it for free. I don't
even want to do this. Please. Yeah.
>> You guys lucked out. Today's your day.
I'm going to pick three people from the
audience. [laughter]
>> Congratulations. You won.
>> Oh, that's funny. That is good. So,
[laughter]
>> any other like sore spots you?
>> No, we're just airing out our worst, you
know, things [laughter] that have
happened to us. Um, I will say on a good
note, so because of like failure and
stuff, it made me search for other
models. And so, like,
>> you know, we were talking before about
how live events are really difficult.
And so,
>> uh, the big problem I was always trying
to solve for was like, I actually do
like doing events. Like, if if you got
rid of I didn't have to pitch or sell
tickets. like we were in the events like
this is like the greatest ever I'm
totally down to do events
>> and that was actually what happened with
the golf group because I wanted to do
golf trips and all this stuff and I was
like but dude if I have to run ads and
convince people to come to this golf
like dude this is like
>> that's a job again.
>> Yeah. Like I don't want to do that. And
so when I we made M19 and we started
making it membership and subscription
like basically everyone's paying you
know their membership fee to have the
right to attend these events and buy
them when they sell out. So now
literally every event we do sells out.
We have 30 to 40 people and there's no
sales team. There's no pushing. It's
just they every, you know, every week
people are just reserving their next
event. And so it's like made events
enjoyable for me again. Not just because
it's golf and not like a seminar,
[laughter]
but like I don't have to sell tickets
and I don't have to pitch.
>> It's such like the perfect business. I'm
I keep trying to think how I can do a
version of that cuz it's so cool.
>> Yeah.
>> Do you like golfing or what do you like
to do?
>> Wrestling, UFC, something like
>> you can do a wrestling group.
>> Yeah. like beat each other up, but
there's not a lot of old wrestling dudes
anymore that are rich. [laughter] You
know what I mean?
>> Are rich. You can get the WWE people.
>> Yeah, you got such a [clears throat]
cool I don't know.
>> Yeah. But I I kind of made it cuz I'm
just like, dude, we're good at events,
but man, I hate everything that has to
happen before and has to happen at the
very end to make it.
>> And your model's so cool, too, cuz like
it's like Costco, right? They get a
Costco card and they come in and pick
other like it's such a cool
>> It's such a cool business.
>> But then like that's why Costco kills
it, too. Like Yeah. How do you think
what like what funnel do you think he
could do for his M19?
>> Because it's such a specific like
>> Yeah, dude. I would Well, I don't know.
>> To give context to the audience,
basically
>> we we've been over a year now. We've got
over 500 members. Everyone's over seven
figures. Uh the average member does
eight figures in revenue a year. But
[clears throat]
>> they pay initiation fee to join. Then
they pay annual dues. And then they get
access to all the events. They can just
choose what event they want to go to and
they pay per event. That's like the
general concept of the money,
>> but they also get
>> mastermind. Yeah.
>> Yeah. But then they also have to golf.
>> Yeah. You can't be
>> You can't be me. You're not invited.
>> Yeah. You can't come. [laughter]
>> Yeah. Come on. I'll learn golf just to
hang out with all you guys.
>> Yeah. You got to like You don't have to
be good. You could be like Brian and
suck, but you like golf. [laughter]
>> Yeah. But like finding that like a
[clears throat] webinar, I don't think
that would work for a webinar, right? I
think it would like
>> really
>> um we talked about this uh one of my
buddies I went to Super Bowl with him
and
>> and so we're hanging out with all these
Super Bowl people and he's like how like
fan basis was a company that sponsored
him because he gambled with them and so
we got free tickets or whatever but he
was like same thing. How would you do
like your kind of marketing for
something like this? I was like, I would
go and do a fiveday challenge where you
got like Tom Brady one day and you bring
in these different people and you get
them in there and like some like
celebrity thing cuz you could get five
you could probably get 10 million people
to register for like a fiveday event
where you get to talk to Tom Brady one
day and you know whatever it is like if
you have like I pick a golfer like I
don't know I don't know the golfers are
pick
>> yeah Tiger Woods is he still cool
>> but do something like that which just
like hey we're doing a three-day um uh
golf business virtual mastermind we got
Tiger coming one day so and so what they
came
like just the names you guys, you know,
you would get you get tons of people and
most of them wouldn't be qualified, but
the qualified people would show up in
there as well
>> and then and then be like, "Oh, by the
way, there's this thing." Like it would
be just a fun they just bring in some.
>> That's actually not a bad idea to try.
>> That'd be a good I thought And then
maybe get a mix of business people too
since it's a business.
>> Especially if you found a golfer who who
had a business, you I mean like we did
for Iman's event, we had Rick Ross uh
come and be he was our guest because
>> because he he's like the hustling guy.
He's at every whatever the hustling and
side hustle like he was he was the dude.
Um but what's crazy like I didn't know
who he was prior to this whole thing,
>> but that segment of the audience did and
they showed up live because they knew
that he was only doing the live session.
They're cutting off afterwards and like
and my son who loves Rick Ross was like,
"Dad, it was so crazy. All my friends
signed up because they wanted to see
Rick Ross and and you happen to have
been there, Dad." Like it's like it
it'll brings a different demo and it
drops the ad cost because
>> again Tiger whoever it is on an ad like
coming to this like golf like how often
do you get to register for free? It's
the reason why MCA's challenge did so
good when Dean and Tony did the Matthew
McConna one cuz how often do you get to
like see Matthew McConna talk about
life? Like it's just a unique experience
people come on you know and I think
>> for a lot of these people you could
bring that celebrity in that they
couldn't and have a unique fun
[clears throat] conversation. I think
it'd be good to maybe do, what do you
think about this? Like a two-day
golf event where like a Tom Brady or
someone like that comes
>> and then they pay to go, but then they
also get pitched there for like the
higher ticket.
>> I just did that on Monday.
>> Who came?
>> Who? Yeah.
>> Who was the dude?
>> Me. [laughter]
>> But I
Well done.
>> No wonder it bombed. [laughter]
>> Actually, I had over 50% close rate.
>> Okay.
>> How many people come to How big?
[laughter]
Again, there was two people. We got one
people. One of them was a cousin.
>> No. So, okay, I'll tell you some more
context. So, uh to this point,
literally, we signed everyone up just a
VSSL. Literally, that's it. And then I
did do a webinar, but the webinar I
called in an open house that was just,
uh me interviewing members, and I'm just
like, hey, what's just testimonials?
Because the biggest objection we get is
who's in the [clears throat] group. And
so, I'm like, let me just invite people
and show you literally who's in the
group. And so that actually works really
well. And so we have that on evergreen
and it happens 2 weeks after they
initially opt in.
>> And so it's like, oh, if we don't get
them in two weeks, then
>> hey, this thing's coming up. And it's
like a follow-up. And it does work.
>> Um,
>> that's how I structure the event that I
have like one big celebrity and then
member testimonials and run a big
virtual front end thing.
>> For sure. We could definitely do that.
>> Um, but the live event that he's talking
about, I actually just ran the first one
on Monday because we have They get a
golf course, people coming to it.
>> Yep. So, our normal events that we do
are three days, members only. And so,
they pay about five grand for 3 days. It
includes three rounds of golf, two
nights at the hotel, food, drink, the
mastermind, everything's included except
they just travel. And so, a lot of them
want to go an extra day early a lot of
times. And so, we've been like coming a
day early and if they want to get an
extra round on that. And I said, you
know what? when we go to a big market,
let's like make that early day like for
non-members to give them a taste of what
we are. [clears throat] Cool.
>> So, we started running ads. This one was
in Austin locally in Austin.
>> I ran ads in Texas, just overall Texas
cuz people drove from Dallas and
whatever. And uh we sold 36 tickets cuz
we only have so many tea times. We can't
even sell that many. Um thousand bucks a
ticket and 30 people showed up plus
members were there for just having fun
anyways. And uh out of the 30 people
that showed, we've already signed up 15.
>> So the conversion was super high and
we'll get more as time goes on.
>> But I was like, "Wow, that was like a
easy funnel."
>> Yeah. Interesting.
>> Yeah. But same thing, we did a
mastermind in the morning. Uh well, we
had breakfast, mastermind for like three
hours, lunch, golf round, cocktail hour.
>> So I pitched right after the mastermind
session before lunch, and then I pitched
again at the cocktail hour. Mhm. That's
cool.
>> Yeah.
>> I'm sure conversions are really high on
that. The hardest part though is just
how many people can you get.
>> You can't get that many. The most is
maybe 40, 50.
>> Yeah. Well, I think if you do the
virtual event, right, you can get 50
60,000 people to register for something
like that. You know what I mean? The
right celebrity.
>> Okay. So, get a golf c I wonder if I get
an entrepreneur who golfs a lot.
>> Tom Brady golfs.
>> Yeah.
>> So, it's like a celebrity that golfs.
>> Yeah. How much would it cost for an hour
or 30 minutes of his time? Doesn't have
to be long. Rick Ross paid for 30
minutes. That was
>> How much did you pay? Yeah. Uh,
contractually I'm not sure off the
record.
>> 30 minutes.
>> Damn,
>> that's a lot.
>> Dang.
>> You'd have to run a lot of ad spend to
make that worth it.
>> Yeah.
>> It might be worth it though.
>> Tom Brady way more than that.
>> Oh yeah, Tom.
>> But I'm I'm sure you could get like a
lower level celebrity for like 20 grand
to go golf. Just like come golf.
>> Golf. Just bring them here or
>> you could definitely get a PGA guy.
[cough]
>> Yeah. [clears throat] But you don't
>> get them to jump on Zoom for 30 minutes
from their hotel room. Like they don't
have to come in or anything. It's just
they're just hooked to get someone to
register. You know what I mean?
>> Show up and stick. I like that.
>> So, is there anything else you think
about any other funnels you think could
work for like a in-person mastermind
that's like more specific like golf?
[snorts]
>> Um,
and these people are already rich, so I
don't know that they're down with the
five day challenge like Yeah.
>> Yeah. I I think I think it' be a one day
or a
>> Yeah.
>> You know, I don't think it needs to be
that much. I think it's more like they
want to come and just like hear what
whoever's got to say. Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> And you have a couple member
testimonials, bring on the person, make
a pitch afterwards.
>> Got it.
>> That'd be a cool two-hour event or
something. Two and a half hour.
>> But the thing is like in this we don't
teach anything.
>> Yeah.
>> You know, like what would in a typical
web like teaching your method? We're
like
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah. So like do you want to go
[laughter]
>> like there's not even like it's just a
pitch. There is no method. It's like
this is what you get.
>> Yeah. But you ask the pro though. It's
just like, okay, like maybe it's a
mindset training with the golf, you
know, because he's not going to teach a
golf through Zoom, but it could be like,
hey, how did you blah, you know, some
mindset something and that's like the
content piece, but the rest of it's just
like this is this group we have, this is
what we do,
>> you know?
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> You could teach the the home method we
learned earlier.
>> Oh, yeah. [laughter] From Adley.
>> She's teaching us all of her methods.
She's the best.
>> Yeah, she's funny. She's actually really
good.
>> Yeah. Okay. [laughter]
But to transition, do you think we're
still in a trust recession? Recession
>> trust recession. Do you think we're
still in a trust recession?
>> I don't know. I think
>> I feel like we were like a year ago
where like everyone was very skeptical
and not trusting.
>> I think it depends if you're a
trustworthy person or not. You know what
I mean? Like Yeah.
>> I think I think probably a lot of people
are, but
>> a lot of people who are in our playing
this game, I wouldn't trust them. You
know what I mean? Yeah,
>> I think that's more the problem. And
it's funny cuz I see a lot of people who
are focusing on that I think are the
ones who
>> who probably haven't been very
trustworthy with their people very much.
You know what I mean?
>> Um
>> I don't know.
>> Or like what do you think is what's big
in the market right now? Cuz I feel like
back a few years ago it was like high
ticket and then I think it moved into
like subscription and like reoccurring
and service. Like where do you think the
market's moving into now?
>> Everybody's like about AI now.
>> Yeah. Yeah. It's like you have to attach
AI to whatever you're selling almost to
make it relevant because if it doesn't
they're like like this is
>> this is old outdated.
>> Yeah.
>> So I think that's the bigger thing is is
is attaching it. And it's interesting
because um
>> I mean you look at I've been doing this
since
>> I was 22 so I've been doing this for
like 25 years whatever. It's like it's
interesting as you watch the cycles
because it's always like um like when I
first got started there are always
people always making money offers
[clears throat] but the dudes who made
the most the money once who it was like
make money with eBay because eBay was
like the the big gorilla that everyone
and they attached to that right and then
when eBay kind of ran its course then
people were trying it was like how to
make money and make money and then like
uh when Amazon came it was like with
Amazon all sudden like it crushed again
or with Groupon or whatever like the big
thing is
>> so AI is the big thing that people are
attaching you know and I think this is
the biggest one we've ever had I I think
it'll it'll last the longest. All the
other ones were very secular.
>> Whatever that word is.
>> Yeah. Cyclical.
>> Cyclical. Yeah, that's the word.
>> Um but I I think it's interesting
because
>> um I think it's like
>> the people who are really good organic,
a lot of those guys are crushed with low
ticket. The on people who do paid ads
can't make low ticket work. You know
what I mean?
>> Impossible. Yeah.
>> So, it's like it's like this weird
thing. So, it's like if you're if you're
paid ads and so it's it's just kind of
like depending on the person's uh
traffic portfolio, I think, is is the
key. You know what I Um,
>> what's your opinion now with organic
versus paid? Because I know obviously
for the most time you were paid only and
then you're like, "Okay, organic's
really important. I really need to focus
on this and like where do you see it
today?"
>> Yeah. Um, I still haven't like we still
haven't killed organic. [laughter] You
know what I mean?
>> You're still organic. So paid is great.
>> Yeah. The more organic I do the the less
p like it drops cost on paid. So like
for me it's even that I look at it was
interesting talking to their team
because they do a launch every 90 days,
right? a challenge and they're buying
traffic like 3 weeks and then the rest
of time they're not. So over the the two
and a half months that they're not doing
it, they're flooding with so much
content and goodwill and everything like
that. And so then when the ads coming in
90 days later, it's like there's so much
goodwill built that their ad costs drop
dramatically again. So like so I think
it's that hybrid of the two. Um but I
think when all said and done it's being
able to flip a switch to turn ads, it's
only predictable way to do business
where it's like the other stuff.
>> How long have you seen like a good offer
last? you know, because it seems like
>> it's you're always chasing the next
trend or variation of something to in
order to just, you know, it's like every
six months people are changing offers
and then,
>> you know, I think about just some offers
are able to withstand many many years
and just they don't even have to
reiterate it. They just run their
business and they're not focused on it
as much.
>> Yeah, it's a great question. My longest
one was the Click Funnels offer that ran
really successfully, probably seven
years before it, you know, shifted. I
look like Jeff Walker. interview had
Jeff on? No. And he's running Product
Launch Formula since
>> I was 24 years old. So, he's 20 plus
years. The same offer.
>> The same offer. Wow.
>> And he still does well. But what's
interesting is like I think most people
um most people get bored of their offer
faster than the market would. Like look
at Jeff. Jeff's just very much like he
just does the thing and keeps doing it.
And then um and he turns his students.
He launches one one week a year too. You
know what I mean? So it's not like it's
he's running.
>> It's not played out because it's only
one week a year.
>> Yeah. And then and then over the year
he's working these these students who
build and launch their own products and
then they all become like his affiliates
for the next year. So it's like it he
creates the people that fill the
>> it's basically new then every year cuz
he's you're not always hearing about it.
>> Yeah.
>> What about like offers that are running
every day? You know cuz like I have
thought about that with these guys who
only do challenges or launches and I'm
like okay it makes sense. It's like you
really do just cap it out. And it's
like, bro, signups are done and we don't
even have a sales team, you know, for
half the year. And I I think about that,
I'm like, well, clearly if you're going
to have a full-time sales team, you got
to like
>> keep feeding stuff. Yeah.
>> You know,
>> so
I guess I've always every product I've
ever sold, it's just like, dude, yeah,
you could buy it whenever. So it takes
away the scarcity and the urgency.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Um it it's different markets are
different things, too. Like obviously
real estate market or my market there's
so many more but I look at like a guy my
inner circle Bill von Fetti he's in the
bookkeeping market and they're spending
100 grand a day consistently for four
years in a row like
>> wow
>> you know so that one just keeps working
but he's the only dude really other than
a couple people trying to copy him but
he's the only one there so I think it's
a lot of just is like how big is the how
big is the pool of people in that market
the addressable market and how many
people are all fishing out of the same
pond too you know what I mean
>> cuz um it was interesting even uh the
$50,000 offer we made. We got a guy made
my circle a few minutes ago was just
like I some sell something similar for
15 grand. So it's like there's other
people selling very similar thing, you
know, and everyone's kind of competing
against us. So um
yeah,
>> dude, that was the funniest thing I saw
at funnel hacking or two years ago. The
last one and uh
>> it was the last one. So [laughter] the
next one
>> it was the last one at that time. So the
I'm just like walking around in the back
and all I all I see is just all these
people like wheeling and dealing their
own crap. [laughter] I'm just like,
"Wait a minute. What is going on here?"
And this is like
>> that was probably I think frustrating
about FHL too is like I spent all this
money bringing people table and then
like people buy tickets, come back and
then like one of my friends he on the
flight home he's like I booked you know
$600,000 in sales in the back room FHL.
First thing I was just like
>> he paid $1,000 for a ticket. I'm like,
>> I spent so much money and risk for him
to make money at my event. And I was
like,
>> I see people like, yeah, I'm throwing my
own afterparty and then these guys are
doing this. No, like tons of people like
there are people like I'm running out of
penthouse and I'm taking calls and who
and I'm just like
>> the parasites coming after.
>> I'm like this this place is so just like
an STD like [laughter]
just
>> it's a big reason why like I don't want
to do it cuz I'm like yeah it's like all
these people and it's like and then our
competitors come and they're doing
stupid and it's just like
>> that's funny. I don't know, man. I get
jaded sometimes about stuff like that
where it's just like
>> it reminds me of a giant club where
everyone's looking to hook up and I'm
like
>> this is interesting. Like it's a great
experience. [laughter]
>> I guess maybe like a club,
>> but I'm like bro like everybody is just
trying to sell and pitch something like
cuz like our events aren't like that cuz
like
>> uh even at wealthcon and stuff like
people aren't trying to go sell like a
competing product or off like it's like
okay I'm coming here to learn from these
guys. they're trying to learn real
estate or whatever versus mine is like
we all have our own product we're
learning digital marketing
>> everybody's got some form of digital
marketing product is interesting
>> you know
>> what about like sales teams do you do
you still have a a big sales team or
what do you think the future of that is
>> we have a small sales team um
>> uh
sales team stress me out so we've got
we've got a handful of people but
>> um we're using a lot more AI on the
front end stuff really
>> um yeah from like appointment setting
and even we've done AI phone calls that
have done that have done well. Like part
of it was we did an AI challenge. So we
had a we had an AI phone rep call
everybody ahead of time like hey I'm
Russell's AI phone rep and people were
like
>> it was funny cuz like first hello and
they're like very offset and they're
like hey this is AI and they're like
you're AI like yeah like oh and then
like they would tell everything like
they're just like
>> really
>> because they didn't think it was a
person.
So, we get all the stuff back, but then
after um
>> after we we had the AI call everybody
who hadn't bought and was like, "Hey, uh
we saw that you were on the the
challenge, but you didn't buy, Russell's
giving me permission to show you how we
set up me as a caller
>> and uh you get it for free as long as
you buy right now on this call."
>> And uh so he gave a bonus specifically
to that call and then uh it generates a
link that sends to them. That's a
different order form that expires when
the AI hangs up.
>> And so it was crazy. They closed a ton
of more sales force like there wow.
>> So it's like I think augmented sales
teams are going to be bigger. I think
there's always going to be obviously the
space for the closers but I think
setting will get more and more replaced
by
>> um AI. I think a lot of closing will
happen without without people.
>> I don't think it's perfect yet but I
think over time um you know
>> the best AI I've seen is Alex Hermosis.
>> So his AI text me and it was blue text
>> and I was like is this AI? And it was it
was like, "Yes, I'm AI, but I could
answer all your questions." And it kept
like following up with me and like
interacting with me. I was like, "Oh,
wow. I've never seen this before."
>> Yeah.
>> From a blue text.
>> What do you think happens in the guru
world as time goes on and information
kind of becomes less valuable.
>> Yeah. Um, we I did a whole session on
FHL about that because I was like, it's
funny, I'm getting blown up on social
cuz I was like, courses are, as you guys
know, are dead. And so people are taking
screenshots and everyone on on
Facebook's like, "Russell is trying to
sell some. The courses aren't dead." But
I'm like, "Yeah, I'm not dead today, but
it's gonna get harder and harder to sell
just a course."
>> Yeah. They're like Joe Biden. He's like,
>> "Yeah,
>> he's dead. He's still alive, but he's
like he's still alive, but like
[laughter] we know."
>> Yeah. That's how I equate when I say
things are dead. I'm like, "They're not
dead today." [laughter]
>> Remember that congressman or
>> like And then they're like, "Oh, that
makes I get exactly what I mean. Like
he's still there.
>> Zombie wandering." Yeah. Yeah,
>> my premise I told people and maybe it's
cuz I'm trying to sell something. Um,
but at the same time, I'm like I think
it's the integration of of information
software. I think like why Clickfunnels
did so well is because we had software
and education combined is what made that
that movement that that built Click
Funnels, right? And I think for everyone
it's like if you're just selling
information and a year from now it's
going to be it's going to get worse and
worse. But it's like now you can turn
all your information into software. It's
like we're publishing uh Vincent James
and uh he's written like seven books
that I I licensed from him. So I so I
was like I need software with these
books. So I just literally sent
Overskill. I'm like here's Vincent's
book. Can you read it? And then build
some software based on this book and it
turned each book into its own software
products. And I was like when I sell
like you get the book plus you get the
software when you sign up and like and
um it just it took me 30 minutes to
build software on all six seven of his
books, right? And so I think that's the
future because then it's like now
someone can read something but then
>> in fact I'm rewriting all my books right
now with that same premise of like in
the past I in the book I teach a
principle and I give an exercise to go
do the thing. Now they don't need the
exercise to do the thing. They read the
book and then like copy this prompt into
whatever AI you're using and it'll do
the thing for you.
>> Oh that's cool.
>> And so last time I'm rewriting the book.
So I think courses I think continuity I
think coaching programs uh Richmond Den
did a presentation FHL. He calls it the
prompt path where he's like he has this
coaching program and then each thing is
like here's the strategy and here's the
prompt to do the strategy. So it's like
instead of like go do the work, it's
like watch the videos so understand it,
copy and paste this and then his entire
coaching program is based on this prompt
path and move somebody to the to the
finish line. It's like for me I think
that's where the future of
>> coaching and courses go. It's just like
it people don't have to do the work.
They just hear you teach the strategy
and then AI will do it for them.
>> It's it's funny you bring that up.
[clears throat and cough] I had a buddy
who uh you know he's he's been in the
guru world forever consulting and
selling his own products and stuff and
um he had a bunch of us get together and
he's like hey I want you guys to give me
some honest feedback about this product
and it was an AI software product uh you
know teaching about you know marketing
and all this stuff from all their
knowledge bank and what they have and
you know he's showing the prices and
stuff and I was like dude I got to be
honest with you
I because everyone's like yeah it's
great go for it all this stuff And I was
like, "Dude, I got to be honest with
you. I think this is worth zero
dollars." [laughter] And I was just
like, I gota I can't be your friend and
not tell you the truth. I'm like, I
think this is worth I mean, and I'm
saying I don't think it sucks. I think
it's helpful, but I think the market
value of this is zero dollars.
>> Yeah.
>> And I said, I just think software is
worth zero like in the future. Like I
just think it's a lead magnet. It's a
bonus. It's all of these things in the
future. And I said, but you it's
absolutely can be used like what are you
going to sell on the back end? How
what's the monetization on the back end?
Are you using tokens? Are you going to
have some high ticket offers? They're
consulting. I think it's a great bonus
or lead in. But dude, if this is the
core thing and you're going to try and
get a,000 bucks a month or whatever, I'm
like, bro,
>> be hard. Yeah,
>> do not do this.
>> Yeah. That's why I'm afraid of like um
AI because it just seems like everything
AI is just getting cheaper and cheaper
and free and free and free.
>> So then I'm like I don't understand how
all these companies that are worth so
much are going to be worth anything when
like someone can just rip them off
>> and create the exact same thing for
free.
>> Yeah. We even like
>> even your $25 thing like to me that's
like crazy how cheap it is to to buy.
>> I bet you your $25 thing will be free.
>> Yeah. Yeah. For us it's like we make
money on the credits, right? Really
build
>> but even that like right now all the
credits are subsidized, right? So like
eventually you think that they're going
to have to go to like what it actually
is costing for these things. Yeah.
>> So when the AI companies happen, how's
that how's that downstream everything
else affect? All a sudden like when
credits get more expensive.
>> Well then the open source models will be
a fraction of the cost.
>> Yeah.
>> That shifts back to that. Yeah. Over to
that.
>> I don't know. It's it's interesting.
>> Yeah. Because like I'm sure you thought
about it. Why not just make it free? How
many more customers?
>> But $25 is worth it. I'm saying if you
were trying to charge like 2500,
>> but it's like a paid webinar versus, you
know, a free one. It's like
>> he he's missing out on n or 20x the
people that would otherwise use it.
>> Maybe
>> if it was free.
>> Yeah. How many people do you think would
use it
>> if it was absolutely free?
>> Yeah, I know. That's a qu my question on
our side is just like
>> if they build 20 apps but they're not
paying for it then then we're hosting
like weird costs that way. Plus like how
do you if we try to sell this in the
future like
>> well they'd have to a whole bunch of
random people. Yeah. But they but the
tokens are onetime thing right? You
build the thing in the token then it's
[clears throat] then it's there.
>> So there's got to be something to just
making sure that that relationship's
actually live thing versus you know what
I mean? So, I don't know. We're We're
playing with ideas. Still new.
>> Like my opinion is once it So, Russell
releases this to your point. What's to
stop somebody being like, "You know
what? Clone Russell's
>> Yeah.
>> And then freaking
>> sure
>> let's make it free."
>> Mhm.
>> And it's like to me it's just like all
software results in zero. It's a
>> race. That's literally my opinion on it.
>> Who was the guy that we had on here that
uh he worked for Facebook and he had he
went public?
>> Anthony Pompiano.
>> Yeah. I was asking him too. I'm like,
you have a finance like bookkeeping
thing, but like
>> Yeah. No, I don't know if it's free, but
the other day Claude or Chat was trying
to get me to hook up my bank account to
it
>> so I could do like my P&L and all this
stuff and I was like, why would I go pay
for your thing when like chat is like
trying to do it for free right now?
>> I think for us long term, like the
bigger business model probably isn't
credits or the monthly fee, it's the
transactions, right? M
>> because that's the thing is like if we
can build I it's like
>> you've seen blow up the last little
bit and we're partnering with them on
overkill which is cool because they're
>> um
>> a piece of the payment process like if
overkill's free and now you process
every payment
>> that's like click funnels we processed
uh 14.1 billion through Clickfunnels so
far and we were with Stripe so we got a
we got a percentage of that
>> but yours is going to be bigger with
>> WOP's way bigger percentage and it
becomes a you know so that becomes a lot
of the business like how much can we
help people per you know produce and
create and like Yeah, then it just
becomes a race of I'm just using this to
get distribution
>> to use my backend tokens and payment
process.
>> But I think $25
I would rather use Russell Brunson's,
you know, funnel building thing than go
use one that's free because obviously
yours has way more context and way more
history and way more feedback. Exactly.
So, I'm saying the $25 ones are fine,
but these people that are trying to
charge $1,000 a month or $3,000 a month,
>> sell think about this like pre- sales
force.
>> Well, that's what I was telling my
buddy. I'm like, "Bro, this people ain't
buying this."
>> Yeah. You know, pre- Salesforce people
were charing, you know, to get a CRM
installed. It was like $500,000 to
install your CRM, right? And Salesforce
comes out with first ever SAS platform.
It's like, yeah, it's 100 bucks a month.
And like that just wrecked the entire
industry. And I feel like this is that
next big shift of that from like that to
SAS to like software need to be free. So
it's like what's the what's the benefit
the software gives and like can you make
transactions on that which for us is
credits or processing.
>> Yeah.
>> You know
>> I can see charging for like the agent
thing that you that you're doing because
they're actually getting things done.
>> Yeah.
>> But like software where you still have
to go do stuff is like
>> Yeah.
>> tough to charge.
>> Yeah.
>> Charge a lot.
>> Yeah. That's a weird world,
you know, like the race to the bottom.
Um, did you ever read Evan Pagan's book
Opportunity?
>> No.
>> Is uh he wrote like I don't know 10
years ago. And one of the things he said
him thinking about the future, but he
was like in the future he's like there's
going to be less like billion dollar
opportunities, but there's going to be a
billion $100,000 opportunities. And he's
like, "That's the future." And I I
didn't really understand it back then,
but now I'm like, "Oh my gosh, I can see
this." Like I feel like I feel like I
could pump out a $100,000 a year thing
every 15 minutes now. You know what I
mean? And anybody could like but to like
build a billion dollar exit. Like I
don't know how to do that.
>> 100 offers at $100,000.
>> I I thought about this a lot though cuz
it's like real estate guys. Like I was
like that's how you guys play this game.
Like I flip all these houses and you
have a portfolio. I'm like it seems
easier. Like if I was if I wasn't in the
role I'm trying to do where I'm trying
to build my last big software company.
Um, I would be the opposite where I'm
just like, "Okay, I'm going to try to
build 10 $100,000 a year businesses and
build a portfolio and then add in every
year add in one or two little ones and
just keep those." I do think there's I
think that's where the opportunity is
for most people is just is smaller, but
there's a lot more volume. So, if you
look at like real estate where I'm
building my virtual real estate
portfolio, I think that's where for the
mass is where the opportunity is.
>> Yeah. The worst part about making a lot
of money is that you have to pay a lot
of taxes on it. This is exactly why I've
partnered with Taylor Tax Strategy. You
may have heard me talk about all these
different types of strategies like cost
segregations and depreciation and lots
of other things, but the reality is
there are so many other strategies right
now that you can be taking advantage of.
The team will audit your situation this
year and also previous years to see if
you're entitled to tax savings that you
did not take advantage of. So, if that
sounds good to you, go to tailor-tax.com
today. How do you how do you look at
distribution now? Because even if
somebody's going to go build their own,
you know, SAS product, they got to get
users. And
>> you know, we're talking about, it's
crazy to think, but we're like debating
whether or not it should be $25 or free,
right? [laughter]
>> But but that's like the debate now.
Before it would have been like, oh man,
like Salesforce is this and yeah,
>> I get this for that. And it's like, h
well, you know, I'll pay $500 a month
then that's fine. And now it's like
>> I ain't paying that. I can get this done
for free, you know? And so
>> I paid $2,000 once and it's free after
that forever. Yeah.
>> Yeah. And that's the reality of the
world. Um, so I'm just kind of thinking
like
>> this is distribution. This is my
thoughts on it because um,
>> you know, I collect old books. So like
>> yeah,
>> uh, I think I'm at like 25,000 books I
bought last four years, right? And my
biggest problem I have as a book
collector is like I have all these books
and I keep buying the same one. Like I
find it I'm like, "Oh, and I buy I buy a
book for 10 grand. I bring it home. I'm
like I bought twice in the last three. I
already have three of them." Right? Like
why do I keep doing this? I [laughter]
have no idea. And so I was like, I need
some way to know. Yeah. Oh, you have no
idea. I'm like, I need some way to like
>> This garage is crazy. [laughter]
>> I need some way to
>> million dollars in this garage.
>> I need some way to like to know what I
did. So I was like, I need a software
that I can scan my book. So I have like
my whole catalog. So I went and started
finding them. And there's like five or
six products. They all suck.
>> And this is right when AI coding starts
happening. So I started building my own
version. I'm like, I like to feature
from this one and this one, this one.
And I built one that is by far the best
on in the entire market. I've got um uh
this girl that works for me who's going
through every one of my books, taking
pictures, cataloging, putting them in
there. So, I have this huge database of
my own stuff. Um and it's the best one
in the market by far. And I was going to
build it anyway, no matter what, right?
Cuz I need it for me. But now I have the
best book catalog thing on the world.
And I am a book nerd. I'm in like 30
Facebook groups with people who collect
books. And so when it's done and I put
up an order form, I'm just be like, "Hey
guys, check out how I cataloged my
library." And they're going to be like,
"This is insane." and all my book nerds
from all these different things are
going to start using it. And maybe it's
10 bucks a month or 20 bucks a month,
whatever. But I'll probably get I
probably get a thousand people in there
that will just come to use mine and
there's no ads running. There's no
nothing just cuz I'm the only one. I'm
passionate. I'm doing it any I would
have built it anyway. Now things making
10 grand a month, $120,000 year business
>> and that's a distribution. So I think I
think it's like finding these weird
niches that are underserved because
nobody would have spent the money to
build the software in him anyway. Like
the wrestling world's the same way.
There's like one company built software
and there's no other wrestling software
on the planet cuz no one's going to
invest any money where I bought
wrestler.com and I'm like I just got to
build something cuz there's no
>> You bought wrestler.com.
>> That's good. How much was [laughter]
that? I want to know. I'm
>> funny. Wrestling.com was like half a
million and then wrestler.com was 30
grand. I was like
>> that's a good deal.
>> Oh, so good.
>> How many domains he owns?
>> How many?
>> What would you guess?
>> Uh I know of me I'm probably 3500. So
you more
>> killer, [laughter] dude. I I want to see
it after this.
>> Yeah. Where you at? Not not that.
>> The problem is like they're like 10
bucks a month and so like
>> I know and the problem is like I'm
looking I've been paying for 20 years
because like [laughter] I love the idea
like I never cancel anyone. It's like
this gets really expensive as it keeps
adding things on.
>> I know and they're so pointless. Have
you ever flipped any?
>> No. I'm a hoarder. You [laughter]
>> I know that's my I've never flipped one.
>> It's like my book buying people always
like cuz books are really good
investment like they hold their value.
They they they grow faster in the stock
market all these things.
>> But you have to sell it to get any you
know return.
>> Yeah. the guy that sold me that he sold
me like a million and a half dollar book
and he's like he's like the return on
this is amazing. I was like yeah if you
sell it but I'm a hoarder like
>> this is just a sunk cost.
>> What book did you buy for a million and
a half dollars?
>> I bought two at a million and half so
far. So I got [laughter]
>> the same one on accident
>> from the same. This guy [laughter] is
helping out.
>> He's like a
>> Yeah,
>> this guy keeps fighting. [laughter]
It's the only copy.
Uh the first one I bought was um uh
Napoleon Hill wrote a book in 1928, a
book set called Law of Success and three
years prior he wrote um he did the first
version he printed himself. He sent to
like all the people he interviewed and
the president stuff like that. And so uh
there's only one complete known copy and
it's signed and so it's uh like 17
books. So that was my first I was a 1.5
million for that.
>> Wow.
>> And then in the Mormon world uh the most
rare Mormon book is a book called the
Book of Commandments. Joseph Smith was
our first prophet. He had all these
revelations and uh and then he wanted to
print them in a book. So they they were
compiling them all and they tried to
rate they tried to earn enough money to
print 10,000 copies but they couldn't
get enough money. They finally got
enough to print 5,000. So they they got
the printing got all in there and
they're printing in this printing house
>> and then the mobs who hated the Mormons
came and they burned the [clears throat]
the thing to the ground. And it was as
they were burning it to the ground, a
bunch of papers flew out. And there were
these two girls, like 14 and 16 year old
girls, who grabbed some of the paper and
they hid in the cornfield filled with it
while the thing was burning down. And
from that, they were able to put
together a hundred books. And um right
now there's only [clears throat]
uh there's like like Stanford's got one,
Harvard's got one, the churches like I
think there's only two in in private
hands.
>> Wow.
>> So I have one of the two and that was
>> what is it called?
>> Book of Commandments.
>> Book of Commandments. So that's the
that's my of all.
>> Is that when the book of Abraham got
burned?
>> No, a different time.
>> That's a different time. What's in that
book?
>> Book of Abraham.
>> No, the book the
>> book commandments. Yeah.
>> It's nowadays uh what we would call the
Doctrine of Covenants. And so it's it's
just the very first preirst edition of
that.
>> Interesting. How different is it than
the current DC?
>> Um so there were 101 revelations back
then. That was like 140 or whatever. How
many? 138 or something like that. So
just more.
>> Oh, okay. But they all made it into the
current one.
>> Most of them. Yeah. There a couple that
didn't. Got it.
>> But yeah, so but in the books like it's
like this big. It's a little tiny book
and it's like cool.
>> Interesting.
>> So those are my two
>> that 1.5 million book is this big.
>> Wow.
>> Oh yeah. It's like Yeah. It's like this
big.
>> Have you read it?
>> Um not that version. [laughter]
>> You don't even read the book you paid
for.
>> I bought a big replica. So I bought a
replica and read that. But I'm like like
Yeah. It's
>> You don't want to ruin it.
>> Yeah. [laughter] That's amazing.
>> Yeah.
>> You were showing You were showing us Was
it the $ 1.5 million book that you were
showing us at the office?
>> The Hill ones? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I
showed him the I saw the he was showing
us it and he was like he had his gloves
on and he
>> I didn't have gloves, [laughter]
>> but it was like very delicate like
>> dang.
>> Yeah, you don't want to ruin those
things.
>> Do you have any old Bibles? Have you
ever bought How old?
>> Yeah, I have a bunch from the 1700s,
1600s and stuff. Oh, wow.
>> I haven't started my big Bible
collection yet because it's a slippery
slope because there's so many and so you
know what I mean? Yeah.
>> Um
>> and so I have a few but I'm waiting till
I have our events. We're building a
museum for this all and so I'm trying to
figure out and then I want to get very
certain like I want to try to get a
tinsel and like all the like the and
some of those are crazy expensive. You
know what I mean? So
>> yeah like how expensive
>> like the like a Gutenberg last time a
Gutenberg Bible sold was in the 80s.
>> Um it would sell for it would probably
be three or $400 million right now.
>> Wait. Yeah. Gutenberg first edition.
Yeah.
>> $300 million
>> for Gutenberg. Yeah. They
>> there's only a few of them and they
don't sell and they're usually they're
in like public institutions and it's
almost impossible for a book to go from
public institution back to private
hands.
>> So you have to find something that's in
private hands and
>> and
>> yeah those are hard. So but I think a
tinsel you can get for
>> I don't know probably a couple million.
>> How much of your net worth is in books?
>> Most of it. [laughter]
>> Yeah. Do you invest in stocks or books
more?
>> No books.
>> Really?
>> You like alternative investments?
>> I have zero stocks.
>> Do you have Pokemon cards?
>> No.
>> No just books.
>> Just books. Yeah,
>> just knowledge.
>> Yeah.
>> Wow.
>> They make me happy.
>> What made you start like doing that?
>> Uh I bought a first edition Book of
Mormon.
>> Um
>> first edition
>> cuz So I was on my mission. So I was
like Charizard.
>> Yeah. There's like a holographic Joseph
Smith [laughter] inside of it.
>> First edition Charizard.
>> Yeah. When I when I was on my mission, I
was a 19-year-old kid and we baptized
this lady who was flipping Mormon stuff
on eBay. That's how she made her her
business. And I remember I always see
these old books at her house and she
shows I'm like, "These are so cool." And
then one day she showed them to eBay.
She's like, "This is the first edition
Book of Mormon." And she's like,
>> "What the heck?" And uh and I didn't
know at the time that there's like 5,000
were printed and there's only about 350
known copies and there was one on eBay
and she was like this is my dream to
have that. So like I was a 19-year-old
kid and I forgot about that till um
Click Funnels like four or five years
into ClickFunnels. This is probably 10
years ago and I had a bad day one day
and so I was like that popped in my
head. As I went to eBay, I like first
edition Book of Mormon and there's one
for sale and I looked at for like two or
three days and I looked for some other
ones and and this one was like this one
was only 30,000. So was it was pretty
inexpensive compared like
>> 30,000 19. How'd you get Wait, where did
the money come from?
>> No, this is like this is like 10 years
ago. So
>> that's still expensive 10 years ago.
>> That's cheap now. The first book goes
$250,000 today.
>> Wow.
>> And so that one was 30 grand and it was
missing some a couple pages. So, I
bought that was the first one I bought
and it was like I got it and then it was
such a cool experience cuz I like share
with my kids and tell them the story
behind it and then I took it to church
and sh and like telling the story behind
it. Yeah.
>> Like I was like this is my favorite
thing I've ever done.
>> So I started buying other things and I
share the story and like
>> how much have you invested into books?
>> Um I would say we're probably 13 to 14
million something like that.
>> Wow. What do you think is worth now?
um they go I don't it's hard to know
because
>> what's the liquidity of selling books
are well it depends in the in the Mormon
world it's a very defined market with
prices and and dealer and people know
what it is so it's like it's very simple
I could go and put my I could put my
collection up I can sell it really quick
yeah uh most people donate to the church
for write offs but but I could sell I
could sell the the the Mormon stuff
really easily because it's
>> like even like when I bought the Book of
M there's like a like all the really
rare ones like there's like um a
genealogy so people know like it was
owned by so and so name so and so it's
like it's like my name's in in like the
thing that people know like Russell like
everyone in our world would know that I
have this one cuz it's like where it's
at you know but in like the Napoleon
Hill personal development advertising
it's just the wild there there's no
>> there's no people so those would be way
harder to sell and there's less buyers
because I think I'm the only one really
buying most of that kind of stuff you
know what I mean and then people then
people are buying and trying to sell it
to me cuz like
>> you're the only you're the whale
>> yeah I I get in a lot of like bidding
wars with myself cuz it's
>> cuz I know who it is and then like you
know I'm like Milton like he I text me a
few minutes I saw like
>> so like I'll buy like I'll get I see
he's been I'm like don't buy it dude
like
>> he's like pay you
>> yeah like it's just cheap it anyway. So
>> do you know Jacob Hansen?
>> Uh yeah
>> yeah I'm having Well I had him on like
two like two weeks ago.
>> Okay. For which one? I have a YouTube
page. Yeah. I have a Christian YouTube
page where I have like different
denominations come on. You've probably
seen his clips. Yeah.
>> Okay. I've watched a lot of
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's my
channel. the way. Yeah. Oh,
>> okay. Yeah.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Jacob Hansen's been posting
those clips.
>> Jacob's interesting. Very good. One one
of the best like modern apologetic.
>> Yeah. I would say he's like the best
Mormon.
>> He's great at debate. Yeah. I don't
agree with all his all his stances, but
he's way better at debating than he is.
I've never
>> Oh, yeah. He's a genius.
>> I tried debating him like for fun. And
it was so hard cuz he's very good at
like taking you off the topic and kind
of storytelling and then you're like
like where are we at? Like you'll like
look on the road and you're like, "How
did you come to that conclusion from
where we started?"
>> Yeah. I'm like, "Where are we at right
now?" But but it's that's the
apologetics world. They like
>> Yeah, they really get that.
>> Yeah.
>> I got a funny story. So, did I ever tell
you about how I bought my rookie card?
>> No.
>> Okay.
>> Wait, your own rookie card?
>> Yeah.
>> So, dude, I got drafted in 2010 and I
didn't sign for like barely any money
and I didn't sign a card deal or
nothing. And so, I uh I'm at a game
during spring training and this kid
goes, "Hey, can you sign your card?" And
I'm like, I have a card. And so it's
this card of me. You can go look it up
online. It's me in Oakland A's uniform
about to tag somebody. I was like, dude,
let me see this. And I'm looking at it.
And then I look at the back and it's
got, you know, my description from
college and all this stuff. And I was
like, dude, that's tight. So I sign it.
I was like, all right, I got to go buy
some of my own card. Like I was never
even given one, nor have I been paid for
one. And um so I go on eBay and you
know, I see there's a couple listed for
like a dollar and I'm like, tight. So, I
buy these cards for a dollar and uh you
know, whatever. Play my first season and
uh I go back on eBay cuz a couple of
relatives and family want some and I'm
some no name minor leaguer and I look
and I see it. They're like Ryan Peneda
oneofone
um printing plate.
>> And I was like, wait, this is a oneof
one
>> printing plate for the card.
>> Yeah.
>> Oh, that's cool.
>> I know. And so I was like, dude, this is
the printing plate. It's one of one.
This is literally what they use to make
the card.
>> Mhm.
>> I was like, what are the odds this is on
eBay? I'm thinking in my head like I I
have to kind of like buy this for
whatever the price is.
>> I look at the price, it's $25.
[laughter]
>> Whatever it takes, I'm getting this.
>> Yeah. I was like I was prepared in my
mind and I was like 10 grand. Yeah. I
was like I was a 22-year-old broke minor
league baseball. I was like
>> freak dude. Where am I going to like
dude if this is like a few thousand
bucks this going to be a [laughter]
stretch but like I'll do it. It was $25.
>> So, I still own it to this day.
>> That's so cool.
>> Yeah. So, that's my most precious. It's
still worth [laughter] nothing. But, um,
>> it's my favorite thing collecting is
other things cuz the books are cool, but
like um the other assets from the
author. So, that's something I've been
doing lately. So, like Napoleon Hill,
like I have his typewriter, his glasses,
stuff like that. Same Earl Nightingale,
I have his typewriter, his microphone,
his glasses, his Medal of Honor, like
like all this stuff. So, like those are
cool too cuz
>> cuz then it's like all these things that
tell the story better of
>> Yeah. Do LDS believe in like relics? Do
they have relics?
>> Oh yeah,
>> they do.
>> You mean relics? As far as
>> like human bones or like stuff like
that?
>> I've seen people try to sell like hair
from famous people, but that's creepy. I
don't like that stuff.
>> Oh, okay. [laughter]
>> And I'm like, and how do you even know?
Like
>> like the Catholics and the Orthodox,
they save relics like bones and stuff
like that from
>> uh I'm aware of though.
>> Saints and then they believe that they
have like special power.
>> Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> I've heard a little bit things like
that, but I don't think it's as
prevalent. Yeah, that'd be interesting
if you could like start get into relics.
>> Yeah.
>> Like dinosaur bones or stuff like that.
>> Yeah.
>> What would the tablets be worth?
[laughter]
>> Oh, bro. A billion dollars for for the
church, bro. Yeah.
>> Yeah.
>> Billions.
>> That would be [laughter] that'd be nuts.
>> Or the hat or whatever the thing was.
>> Yeah.
>> Joseph Smith hat. [laughter]
>> Yeah. I'd buy that.
>> Like, oh yeah.
>> [laughter]
>> You're going to go buy an old hat and
like post it and tag me in this hat.
>> You serious about that?
>> Russ buy this quick.
>> When would you buy like get it and put
it in dirt? Like make it [laughter] look
old.
>> Drop it up a little bit.
>> That's funny. So dude, as we wrap up
here, um I mean for you, you you're in a
lot of different companies still. I mean
like you have uh Clickfunnels, you you
are doing this new one with um
Overskill. Yep. Yep. And then you're
doing, you know, you have your own just
kind of education division that you, you
know, do yourself and like what what
else is on the horizon? Is it staying
focused on those things? Is do you see
yourself
still just kind of do more of the same?
Like what's the plan?
>> It's funny because like I think my
internal employees and I think a lot of
people externally like see all these
different things, but in my head it's
like uh for me it's all like one
mission. Like my mission like our
mission statement is like our job is to
free all entrepreneurs so they can focus
on serving or changing lives of
customers they've been called to serve.
So for me it's like how do I free
entrepreneurs? It's like well I do it
through software. So click funnels was
the core thing right? Overskill is the
new thing. Um we free entrepreneurs
through education. So it's like we have
education. Um a lot of entrepreneurs
struggle with personal development. So
that's like the personal development
businesses around that. So it's like for
me it's like I've got one avatar and
that's that's for me it's one business
because I have one avatar and I'm trying
different ways to help
>> giving them different products to serve
them.
>> But they look extra like this is a
different business than this and this.
You bought Dan Kenny's business. Why?
And it's like cuz that's what freed me
and I want to free up, you know, so it's
like
>> how has buying businesses been for you?
>> Horrible. I don't think I'll ever do it
again. [laughter]
>> Why?
>> Yeah. My biggest financial mistake of my
entire life was buying a business and
then not selling my business. Those are
my two biggest financial mistakes was
was buying a business, not selling my
business. So um I don't know. I think
it's a different skill set. Like I just
thought like
>> what did you buy?
>> We bought a company called Voomley. Uh
which is like anyway it was three or
four software companies I could code now
in 30 minutes. But we [laughter] we
spent we spent $40 million on them
because we thought we thought it was
going to be it was going to be this big
front end and it was it was killing it.
Like it was it was doing $40 million a
year, 10 million net. Um and we were
buying it right when the Facebook
algorithms were hitting and by the time
we closed it never made money.
>> Wow.
>> Dang.
>> And it was just like
>> Is it still open?
>> Uh probably. Yeah. Servers. No. No one.
Who's going to buy it?
>> How much do you want to buy it for? You
can have it. [laughter]
>> 25 minutes.
>> Yeah. It's just like it was it's so that
was like yeah I think people who buy
businesses like that's what their
business they understand you know what I
mean like I understand
>> transacting business
>> I understand
>> creating an info product building a
funnel driving traffic that's the world
I know and what's the Warren Buffett
thing like don't invest in business you
don't understand like I don't understand
>> like Dan Kennedy business I understood
it like we acquired it and it was that
that was been a really good transaction
that was about the only good one oh you
bought how much did you buy that for
>> uh a couple million bucks it was not
expensive at all we made our money back
during the initial launch and then
profitable since then. So, it was great,
you know, but it's an info business my
mentor like I understand that business
so well versus
>> I Yeah, it's just I don't
>> have you thought about buying a bunch of
smaller info businesses.
>> No. Um
Um No, because I don't think we I don't
think necessarily need more info
businesses, you know, I mean like
>> Yeah.
>> Um we are partnering with Vincent James,
who do you ever read the book 12th
Millionaire?
>> No.
>> Um it's book I read 20 years ago.
Anyway, changed my life. And then he he
basically went on a run. He's been
running from the feds for the last 20 uh
18 years and he just finally anyway he
spoke at our event, but he just wrote 12
million part two. And we're publishing
part one and part two for him.
>> He's still running from the feds.
>> No, he just finished his uh he he went
back like two years ago and then got
everything cleaned up and now he's
>> Okay.
>> Now he's Yeah, it's a it's a crazy
story. The VSSL is insane. Like you
watch it. If you go to 12month.com, you
can watch the VSSL. Like we made an
animated video of him running from the
like showing the whole story. And long
story short, like partnering with him
because like he's got some really good
books. It had a huge effect on me and
like it's kind of this little brand
where it's there's books and there's a
continuity hook to it and it'll be its
own standalone thing. You should be on
the podcast. He lives here locally.
>> Okay. Yeah. Link us up.
>> He's amazing. But
>> um anyway, so that's kind of like um
like that. But I wouldn't go buy someone
else's brand versus like partner with
someone who I think I can amplify the
message really easily my thing. But I
don't think I would buy another
>> another brand. I'd just rather create it
on our own. I guess I would I would buy
the person if it made sense. You know
what I mean?
>> So you we talked about this last time
you were on the pod. This was a couple
years ago. Just uh with selling
ClickFunnels because you were you were
getting a ton of offers with it and then
now you're like, "Yeah, I mean obviously
we should have in hindsight."
>> Like what have you learned from all of
that?
>> Yeah. And can you tell us the story too?
>> Yeah. Um
um I mean the core story was we were
never planning on selling it and then um
people were getting reset all the time
by people and then finally one of the
brokers came and he had talked I think
it was World Bank or something and he's
like they specifically asked about you
that I said based on your revenue like
the merchant volume they thought they'd
be they thought they'd valued over a
billion dollars like dang well maybe
that's that's worth having a
conversation. So that's kind of where it
started and then we decided like well if
we're going to do this we should do the
whole thing right so we hired a broker
and they put together all this stuff and
you have to pay all this money to get
your financials audited or however you
know
>> crazy expensive and then they they start
shipping they start they put out the
whatever the first thing and you get
>> 300 people that are interested and then
they go to the next round they get
smaller smaller smaller and then each
round they get more intimate with people
they ask more questions they try to
figure out how they can pay you less and
less and when all got said and done we
got uh two offers both valued us about
uh valued just a $500 million, half a
billion dollars. Um, and they were both
going to buy a majority of it. And um,
but it was just a weird spot where where
we didn't feel like we were done yet,
but also was like we felt like we needed
to change Click Funnels pretty
dramatically. And if the way it was
going to buy, Todd was going to be done
and be gone and it would have been me
and I don't know how to program and I
don't want to build it. You know, it was
just like this weird thing. I didn't
really want to do it. And um, and I
wasn't ready to be done yet. And so we
said no, which
I want to go back to like whatever 37y
old Russell and just be like, "Dude,
>> that was $500 million."
>> You're gonna call someone and say,
"Yeah, like like
>> you called him and you said no."
>> Yeah. It was crazy. It was like,
>> bro, you got balls, bro. [laughter]
>> In hindsight, like what was I what was I
thinking? What kind of you know,
>> you're like 500? Nah.
>> Do you think that maybe you thought you
were getting a billion and you were
like, "Oh, well then we got to get to a
billion."
>> Yeah. I think part of that is like cuz
they beat you up cuz the first starting
like oh yo you're the greatest you know
it's like they're starting these things
and then and every one of my friends
who've sold or gone through this process
same thing is like it's like they just
find every they do so much due diligence
and they're finding all these things
like oh I didn't realize that oh and
there's like
>> they you know like they're trying to
find ways to they're they're really good
at what they do to to do the value as
low as humanly possible
>> and so I think part of us is like man we
we after going through the process we
knew the things that we needed to fix
and we were weird too cuz typically when
you're growing a software company you
get it to like you $20 million and you
take your first round and then when you
take the round they bring in all the
professional managers to like manage the
company and they go to the next they get
to 50 million and then those guys flip
it to their buddies and then they bring
in the next group. So there's like
>> all these things that where they're like
>> they're um
>> they're professionalizing the business
business each step and we had bypassed
all of those. We're like we're on the
fifth rung of the ladder and we never
take on money. So all these guys are
coming in and they're like like for a
company your size like there's usually
like the people investing at that point
like we don't have the teams of people
that fix your company like you needed to
take money back here so that
>> you'd be ready for us here. So we lost a
lot of people because that there's like
>> like you guys don't have professional
management like you guys a bunch of like
>> you know um just misfits who figured out
how to sell something really good. You
know what I mean? And so um yeah, those
were those are some of the things that
were just interesting that and so we
went through that whole thing and we
learned like man these are like the
things that we need to do to be worth
because I think had we had these things
in place we would I mean think about
Kajjabi we were I don't know five sixx
bigger in Kajjabi and they end up
getting sold for $2 billion
>> because they
>> because Brandon was really smart and had
those guys come in and took a round here
took around here and they have the
people in place and these guys are
selling to their buddies so they're just
getting it ready for the next the next
like level
>> everybody's kind of aligned on getting
>> so they all know what they're So it's
like we have to get these things in
place to sell this guy and this guy I
get these things placed here and then
and then just the whole process and so
we bypassed all of that and so and so we
just I didn't know how to play that
game.
>> What was your IBIDA back then when you
were going to sell for like 500
>> uh we were
between 45 and 50 million.
>> Okay.
>> Yeah. So it been it been like a 10x. So
initially they're valuing based on our
processing
>> but they didn't realize you're processed
through Stripe. So they valued the
processing way less. Yeah.
>> Uh so then it was based off IA. It's
basically TEDx uh
>> what did they think you were pro what
did they want you to process through
>> if we were processing uh like our own
that's why we have paymentsai because
now we own the merchant record stuff.
>> Got it.
>> And so anything happening through there
uh like it's our it's our volume versus
Stripes because Stripe holds on to it's
like if they were to buy us it's like
well Stripe has a we can try to pull
people back but they're stuck in Stripe
versus here any payments that I that's a
very sellable company for us because
it's like any bank would buy it and then
they they own the volume. Right. You
know what I mean?
>> Right. So
>> those things we learned like like if we
didn't if we didn't hadn't used Stripe,
if we had our own thing, that would have
made us over billion. Had we had like
professional CEOs and management team
that would like there like four or five
things where it's like we can fix these
things. And so
>> so did you think like hey I'm going to
turn them down and fix these things?
>> Yeah, for sure. And then we also like
the software like we felt like we
thought and I think it's a mistake now
but we thought to compete we needed to
build out bigger CRM and all the other
stuff. And so we spent time on that
um instead of just focusing on being the
best funnel builder in the world. And I
wish we if I could go back in time, I'd
be like just don't do anything except
for like just
>> focus on just the funnels, which is what
the new AI version is. Just funnel
focus, nothing else. And
>> what do you think it's worth now, if you
don't mind me asking?
>> A lot less. [laughter]
>> I don't know.
>> Do you do you think you'll sell any of
the things that you have?
>> 100%. Uh I think uh we're going to try
to build overskll in the way that we
could um follow that path. Yeah. Yeah.
Because I don't
>> I mean Click Funnels was great has been
a great ride. It's been 10 years of my
life and it's been exhausting and I was
like I remember cuz I've had people hit
me like I've had a billion dollar
opportunity for you. I'm like I don't
I've had a billion dollar opportunity. I
don't want like you know how much work
goes into that. Like
>> I don't want that. And I I wasn't I I
didn't think I was going to try to do
something but overskill's just been so I
think it's really good timing. It's
really fun. We're having a good time
with it. I was like, I want to do this
run, but I don't want to do it in 10
years. I want to try to do it in like
two years. Like, how do I how do I based
on what we know now, how do I run really
hard for 2 years, and then I can
whatever happens and then then I can
focus on just my end goal in two years
from now. I told my wife this all the
time, like I want to be able to in the
event center museum we're building, I
want to read books. I want to write
books. I want to do events talking about
stuff I'm learning. That's that's where
I want to get to. And so, this is kind
of like my last my last like pushing to
grow a company. And then after that, I
don't want to be an active
>> Yeah. Yeah. You were telling me you were
in the process of writing a book last
time you were here.
>> Still in the process of it.
>> Yeah. But that's You need more time.
>> I need to not be running Yeah. a
business as much as like we are. You
know
>> what kind of book?
>> It depends. It keeps changing. Uh I
signed I signed a deal with Hay House 5
years ago and it's supposed to be a
personal development book and that
shifted to a to Anyway, I don't know.
We'll see. [laughter]
>> Yeah,
>> it's going to be a funnel building.
>> Yeah, I know. Well, I finally I keep
changing it to I think they're going to
kill me. I was like finally I was like I
could write Offer Secrets. I own offers
secrets.com. I could write that and it
could be the fourth book in
>> in the trilogy or whatever and I could
have that done really fast. I'm like
fine if that gets the book done like so
I was like okay cool that's way easier.
So I did an event last month called
offer secrets to teach the stuff. So I
just got to put it together. So I think
um my goal would be have the manuscript
done by the end of this year. I think I
could do that and then but then
>> it's hard traditional public. Have you
published traditionally?
>> No.
>> It's tough because it's like you you're
like racing towards something you get it
done and it's a year before you can sell
it.
>> Yeah. They got to do all this.
>> So there's no motivation because you're
just like even when I get this done, I
got to wait a year before I can talk
about it.
>> Why did you even sign with somebody like
>> um initially I want to be New York Times
bestseller. So you kind of have to
>> Yeah.
>> have that. And then um we became really
good friends with Hay House guys.
They're awesome and they do I really
enjoy working with them. And so five
years ago I was like I want to do my
next book with them. And anyway, I don't
think I'll I don't think I'll
do another publishing deal after this.
So
>> yeah, you'll just self-publish like the
rest of them. Makes sense.
>> Yeah. Well, bro, it's always good seeing
you, man. It's always good hanging out.
Uh, if people want to do whatever's next
with you, what should they do?
>> I think go to Overskill and go build
some software. Like, it's
>> go log in and be like, just tell it what
you want and see how cool it is. Like,
>> what's the domain?
>> overskll.com.
>> It's got all the best domains.
[laughter]
>> Overskill.com.
>> Um, all my kids, my kids were the funnel
hacking live. So, we did night one of
FHL. We had everybody going. We did an
overskill hackathon and gave away the
winner 10,000 bucks. But my son Don, he
built 12 apps during FHL. He showed me
at dinner. He's like, "Dad, look at this
one and this one and this one." This is
my kid who's never he dropped out of
high school. He like struggles through
everything. He built 12 apps during that
night during the hackathon. Uh my
daughter built us an app for her
homework. She's like, "I struggled with
studying." So, she built an app that
goes to her PowerPoints or teacher notes
and searches online and comes back and
gives you an outline for what to
actually study for the test and makes
note cards. And so, she built that. Um
uh my other son built uh some video game
like he built a Flappy Bird game and
another game and he built like three or
four games. So it's like
>> it's so cool. My kids are building
stuff. So it's like so easy. Anybody can
do it. Just go and build.
>> It doesn't have to be a software you're
going to sell. It can be software for
something that's annoying in your
business or your life. Like we had my
assistant
>> uh was doing this big book publishing
thing for us. And we used to have eight
people doing this this division and we
laid them all off and she built an app
and overkill that does all eight of
their jobs. and she runs it like in an
hour a week and it runs the whole thing.
So it's like you can create apps for
your internal, you know, inside of your
company to replace people or or
processes. You can build games. You can
build like anything you can dream of.
>> That's crazy.
>> And you can build complex stuff. I built
an entire email text message CRM
platform based on like the way I always
wanted one to work. And it works and
it's insane. And like everything I've
tried to build so far, I've been
building it and um it's it's awesome. So
it's fun.
>> That's cool. overskill.com.
You ever heard the story of the Flappy
Bird founder?
>> No.
>> This dude randomly created Flappy Bird.
You know, people listening to this may
not even remember Flappy Bird, but I
mean, it was like 10 years old or maybe
even longer, 15 years ago. And um it got
to the point where it was making like
something absurd. It was making like a
hundred grand a day.
>> Really?
>> Yeah. Just from the ads and stuff. And
the guy shut it down. He was like, "Oh,
I vaguely remember this."
>> Yeah. He was like, "I'm just It's just
brain rotting everyone." He just took
the app off.
>> Wow.
>> And was printing a hundred grand a day.
>> We should find him now and be like,
>> "That dude's a baller."
>> Yeah. What kind of like how do you feel
about that decision today?
>> He's [laughter] like, "Well, how do you
feel about not selling?"
>> Very similar, I hope.
>> Yeah.
>> Like, let's have a drink. Let's
[laughter] just let's weep our sorrows.
>> Yeah. Um, but anyways, bro, go to
overskill.com, guys. Russell, appreciate
you, man. Thanks for coming through
again. And, uh,
>> you know, I'm excited to see everything
that you build. Hey man, so great to see
you again. I appreciate it.
>> Guys, make sure you subscribe.
>> We'll see you on the next one. Peace.
